Re: Did the Davises see anyone (other than Mrs. Markham)?

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 3:40:29 PM UTC-4, donald willis wrote:
> On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 5:14:15 PM UTC-7, John Corbett wrote:=20
> > On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 3:47:27 PM UTC-4, donald willis wrote:=20
> > > On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 8:07:16 AM UTC-7, John Corbett wrote:=20
> > > > On Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 8:37:32 PM UTC-4, donald willis wrote=
:=20
> > > > > On Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 6:10:55 AM UTC-7, John Corbett wrot=
e:=20
> > > > > > On Wednesday, March 31, 2021 at 7:30:32 PM UTC-4, donald willis=
 wrote:=20
> > > > > > > On Monday, March 29, 2021 at 4:27:13 AM UTC-7, John Corbett w=
rote:=20
> > > > > > > > On Sunday, March 28, 2021 at 5:25:26 PM UTC-4, donald willi=
s wrote:=20
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, March 16, 2021 at 4:11:26 PM UTC-7, John Corb=
ett wrote:=20
> > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, March 16, 2021 at 2:16:09 PM UTC-4, donald =
willis wrote:=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Speaking of the Davises.... A few curiosities:=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Barbara D testified that a "man was coming across the=
 yard.... First off=20
> > > > > > > > > > > [Mrs. Markham] went to screaming before I had paid to=
o much attention to=20
> > > > > > > > > > > him, and pointing at him...." (v3p343)=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > While Mrs. M herself testified, "He cut across Patton=
 St. like this.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Toward Jefferson. Then he was still in sight WHEN I B=
EGAN TO SCREAM AND=20
> > > > > > > > > > > HOLLER...." (v3)=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > If Mrs. M is correct re the point at which she began =
to scream, then=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Barbara D couldn't have seen the suspect while Mrs M =
was screaming and he=20
> > > > > > > > > > > was still in the front yard.=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Another curiosity: Barbara D charts (on CE 534) the p=
ath that she says=20
> > > > > > > > > > > that the suspect took across the front yard. Note tha=
t that path comes=20
> > > > > > > > > > > nowhere near the intersection of 10th & Patton. While=
 Mrs. M is famous=20
> > > > > > > > > > > for her kitty-korner confrontation with him while he'=
s standing at the=20
> > > > > > > > > > > opposite corner of the intersection.=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Virginia D., possibly, reconciles Barbara D & Helen M=
 in her own=20
> > > > > > > > > > > testimony:=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BELIN. Well, let me try and reconstruct your acti=
ons then.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > You heard the shots?=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. Yes, sir.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BELIN. You ran to the door?=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BELIN. What did you see when you got to the door?=
=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. Well, we just saw, you know, the police c=
ar parked down there=20
> > > > > > > > > > > and we wondered what was going on, so we heard Mrs. M=
arkham across the=20
> > > > > > > > > > > street calling.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BELIN. Then what did you do?=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. Well, she told us to call the police, wel=
l, so we went to the=20
> > > > > > > > > > > house.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > We was already in the house, and we went to the phone=
 and called the=20
> > > > > > > > > > > police. (v6p460)=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > If we stop right there, Virginia D's testimony makes =
sense here. She and=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Barbara D hear Mrs M telling them to "call the police=
". And they proceed=20
> > > > > > > > > > > to do just that. No mention of Mrs M screaming yet, a=
nd no sighting of=20
> > > > > > > > > > > the suspect in the yard. She just says to call the po=
lice. They do that.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > However, Virginia D continues, disastrously:=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. Well, she told us to call the police, wel=
l, so we went to the=20
> > > > > > > > > > > house.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > We was already in the house, and we went to the phone=
 and called the police.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BELIN. Then what did you do?=20
> > > > > > > > > > > 460=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. Then we went back to the front door.=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. BEI.IN. Then what did you do?=20
> > > > > > > > > > > Mrs. DAVIS. We saw the boy cutting across the street.=
=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > This v e r y s l o w moving suspect is still in sight=
 AFTER the Davises=20
> > > > > > > > > > > call the cops!? That's where Virginia D's testimony g=
oes off the rails=20
> > > > > > > > > > > here. Up to that point, she seems to reconcile her te=
stimony with Mrs=20
> > > > > > > > > > > M's. Then she has the "boy" still in sight and, for s=
ome reason, "cutting=20
> > > > > > > > > > > across the street". (This is the only time that eithe=
r Davis says that=20
> > > > > > > > > > > they saw the suspect cross a street.)=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > > But until this incredible coda, Virginia D paints a b=
elievable picture of=20
> > > > > > > > > > > the shooting scene: The Davises see and hear Mrs M te=
lling them to call=20
> > > > > > > > > > > the police, and they do. Mrs M then picks up the stor=
y as the suspect is=20
> > > > > > > > > > > running up Patton, and THEN she starts screaming. Aga=
in, believable:=20
> > > > > > > > > > > She doesn't call attention to herself with screaming =
until he's trotting=20
> > > > > > > > > > > off AWAY from her.=20
> > > > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > > > Right, Don. Everybody made all this stuff up just to fr=
ame poor little Lee=20
> > > > > > > > > > Harvey Oswald.=20
> > > > > > > > > I just realized. In my post, I did not say that the witne=
sses--Virginia D=20
> > > > > > > > > & Mrs. Markham--were "making up stuff". I accept their jo=
int story.=20
> > > > > > > > > What you write here does not apply to what I wrote here. =
It's you who has=20
> > > > > > > > > to reject the story!=20
> > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > I have to reject Virginia Davis' testimony=20
> > > > > > > Okay. Then let's go with just one Davis, Barbara D, who in he=
r affidavit=20
> > > > > > > said she found a shell in the front yard, then, in her testim=
ony, said=20
> > > > > > > that she found it in the side yard. "It". Just realized--we d=
on't know=20
> > > > > > > which Davis (supposedly) found which shell in the side yard. =
Maybe it=20
> > > > > > > doesn't matter. Let's amend that statement: Barbara D. testif=
ied that=20
> > > > > > > she found "a" shell in the side yard.=20
> > > > > > > because she said during the=20
> > > > > > > > same testimony that Jeanette called the police before they =
went to the=20
> > > > > > > > door and also that she called the police after they went to=
 the door. Both=20
> > > > > > > > of those things cannot be true. She also said they went to =
the side door=20
> > > > > > > > before testifying they went to the front door. Since she wa=
s sixteen and=20
> > > > > > > > married, I doubt she had been living for very long in that =
apartment and=20
> > > > > > > > maybe didn't know which was the front door and which was th=
e side door.=20
> > > > > > > She did say something like "side door on Patton". She'd know =
which street=20
> > > > > > > was which.=20
> > > > > > > > It's clear she was confused about some very basic facts whi=
ch makes it=20
> > > > > > > > amazing that you would find significance in anything she sa=
id.=20
> > > > > > > We also have to kind of discount Guinyard's testimony that he=
 saw the=20
> > > > > > > suspect knocking shells out of the gun in the side yard, sinc=
e he didn't=20
> > > > > > > follow up on that. We also have to question Benavides' testim=
ony to the=20
> > > > > > > effect that he saw the suspect tossing a shell down here, a s=
hell there,=20
> > > > > > > in the front yard. Why didn't the Davises see that? Barbara D=
 should=20
> > > > > > > have said that she saw the guy tossing down *two shells" in t=
he front=20
> > > > > > > yard. Shells that Benavides testified that he picked up. But =
by the time=20
> > > > > > > of her testimony, it's *no* shells dropped in the front yard.=
 (That she=20
> > > > > > > said she saw.)=20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > If one is truly searching for the truth, one looks for the =
best evidence=20
> > > > > > > > available to lead him to it. Your approach is to follow the=
 anomalies that=20
> > > > > > > > don't fit with anything else.=20
> > > > > > > Like those four anomalists who said the Dealey shooter's wind=
ow was open=20
> > > > > > > all the way. Here, the anomalist is actually the one witness,=
 Euins, who=20
> > > > > > > said the window was halfway open.=20
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > You are the poster child for something Bud has said for a long =
time.=20
> > > > > > Conspiracy hobbyists are really bad at weighing evidence. Oswal=
d dumped=20
> > > > > > the shells in the bushes that are at the corner of that house a=
s he=20
> > > > > > proceeded toward Patton.=20
> > > > > You might want to check the testimony of the Davises again. Neith=
er said=20
> > > > > that shells were "dumped in the bushes". Or check the photo on pa=
ge 266=20
> > > > > of "With Malice". One shell was (supposedly) found under a SIDE w=
indow,=20
> > > > > the other "near the walkway" on the SIDE of the house. Neither sh=
ell,=20
> > > > > then, would have even been near a bush, or near the front yard. N=
ow,=20
> > > > > who's really bad with evidence?=20
> > > > You are.=20
> > > Try again. You start with a false, or at best half-true, premise:=20
> > > "Oswald dumped the shells in the bushes". Well, one shell, supposedly=
.=20
> > > Quarter-true. And Benavides says another "by the bush". But the Davis=
es=20
> > > testified that the two shells that THEY found were on the side yard, =
under=20
> > > a window and near the side walkway. NOT in or near those bushes. And =
you=20
> > > accuse ME of cherry picking!=20
> > Now you are just nitpicking because you have nothing of substance to=20
> > present. The important thing is that Oswald was seen dumping shells fro=
m=20
> > his revolver
> Like I said, LNs find it very hard to admit when they're wrong, as Corbet=
t=20
> here was with his Oswald dumped all the shells in the bushes. If he can't=
=20
> get the details right, it makes you wonder about his Big Picture....

Hilarious. Here you are, not conceding that people are human and make 
mistakes, so you're still trying to make sense of a 1000-piece puzzle that 
has 900 correct pieces and 100 wrong ones (because of human error). 57+ 
years later, you're still no closer to a solution than you were when you 
first started beating your hobby-horse. You're not getting anywhere, Don. 
Your hobby-horse never left the starting gate.

Meanwhile, the Dallas Police, the FBI, the Warren Commission and the HSCA 
each examined all 1000 pieces, realized some of them were simply mistakes 
that didn't belong to this puzzle, and saw the big picture. It was Oswald, 
with the rifle, from the Depository.

   =20
> as he passed from the front yard to the side yard along=20
> > Patton. That is where the shells were found by three different people a=
nd=20
> > all of those shells were fired by Oswald's revolver which he still had =
in=20
> > his possession when arrested in the Texas Theater. All these other phon=
y=20
> > issues you have dreamed up
> Inaccuracy is hardly a "phony issue".
> are nothing more than a lame attempt to=20
> > invalidate all the damning evidence we have that Oswald was Tippit's=20
> > murderer.=20
> > >=20
> > > LNs find it very very hard to admit when they're wrong....=20
> > We don't get as much opportunity as you do.=20
> > > >=20
> > > > Mr. BELIN - About how long did it take you to locate the shells onc=
e you=20
> > > > stared looking for them?=20
> > > >=20
> > > > Mr. BENAVIDES - Just a minute. I mean not very long at all. Just wa=
lked=20
> > > > directly to them.=20
> > > >=20
> > > > Mr. BELIN - You saw where he had thrown them?=20
> > > >=20
> > > > Mr. BENAVIDES - One of them went down inside of a bush, and the oth=
er one=20
> > > > was by the bush.=20
> > > > > Here is a photo of that house:=20
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > > http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zoINb3xg5hM/U-FMq7t628I/AAAAAAAA2IE/y=
Nnt-TaLJfY/s1600/Commission-Document-630--(15).jpg=20
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > > As he was passing those bushes it would be just as accurate to =
say he was=20
> > > > > > in the front yard as it would be to say he was in the side yard=
 and the=20
> > > > > > same would be true of any shells that were dumped as he went pa=
st those=20
> > > > > > bushes. Why on earth would you find significance in the fact th=
at a=20
> > > > > > witness would describe that area as being in the side yard and =
another=20
> > > > > > would described it as being in the front yard or that the same =
witness=20
> > > > > > would describe that place as being in the side yard and months =
later refer=20
> > > > > > to it as the front yard? It's the same damn place whether you c=
all it the=20
> > > > > > front yard or the side yard. Just how would this difference in =
the=20
> > > > > > description of where the shells were found fit into your grand =
cover up of=20
> > > > > > the Tippit murder. Are you claiming these witnesses were pressu=
red to=20
> > > > > > changing where they saw Oswad dump the shells from the side yar=
d to the=20
> > > > > > front yard.=20
> > > > > Actually, that's pretty much the reverse of what I have said!=20
> > > > Then why the hell are you making a big deal that some of the witnes=
ses=20
> > > > said front yard and some said side yard?=20
> > > If they were pressured to say the reverse of the scenario in your=20
> > > question, then they were pressured to say "front yard", in their=20
> > > testimony. That's why the hell....=20
> > If only you had evidence that anybody was pressured to change their sto=
ry=20
> > or a plausible reason why they would have been pressured to change what=
=20
> > they said on this point.=20
> > > > > And who is "Oswad"?=20
> > > > Take a guess.=20
> > > >=20
> > > > Is this really the best you can do?=20
> > > This from John "Quarter True" Corbett!=20
> > Speaking of "Quarter True". You got the correct shooter for the JFK=20
> > assassination but got the location wrong so you only get half credit. Y=
ou=20
> > completely whiffed on the Tippit murder so you get no credit for that. =
You=20
> > end up with half of a half which is one quarter.
> Ouch!=20
>=20
> dcw