Re: The Holy Bible

On Fri, 21 Aug 2026 03:48:17 -0700, Samuel Spade <[email protected]>
wrote:

>[email protected] wrote:
>> On Sat, 15 Aug 2026 22:05:02 -0700, Samuel Spade <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> >(much snippage throughout)
>
>
>> If you put together a government, and an enemy of yours came in and
>> took it over, would you write about your humiliating defeat? That is
>> what the self-righteous pharoes of Egypt contended with.
>

>Ok, so a evil pharoah destroyed all written references to
>Jews having ever been in israel.

It would likely be the Pharaoh that received those plagues, or the
number 2 man. (or woman)

>
>
>> >Biggest argument against exodus: After the 1967 war, Israeli
>> >archaeologists had 7 years to comb the Sinai for traces of
>> >millions of hebrews wandering in the desert. 

It depends on how God arranged things. We don't know exactly.
The Bible said God fed them manna. 
The Bible said God would not let their clothing deteriorate. 

So far, neither of those left any 'footprints'.  
--Bakeries were not needed, so those won't be found there. Also,
--discarded clothing would not be found there.
--God would protect them from attacks. (as long as they obeyed)

>>> They had every
>> >motivation to find something, even ashes from fire pits, or
>> >shards of pottery.  They found nothing.

Then they were probably in the wrong location. Or God provided
everything they needed. The Bible does not show everything all the
time.

>> That is likely because they looked in the wrong spot. As that
>> Egyptologist above said, their exact route is debated. 
>> 
>> So that's to be expected if they traced the route they took, wrong.

>> 
>> "The exact path of the biblical Exodus is historically and
>> geographically debated, with no definitive archaeological consensus." 
>> (AI Overview)
>> >
>> >You can't have 2 million lost Jews wandering the little sinai
>> >peninsula for 40 years without leaving a trace.

One wouldn't think so. Probably Pharaoh but the Bible mentions his
armies bit the dust. Notice some more facts:

AI Overview:
"View allWhether Pharaoh died at the Red Sea is a subject of debate.
The text in Exodus says his army, chariots, and horsemen drowned, but
it does not clearly state that Pharaoh himself went into the water or
died."

>> 
>> Correct. So if they search the right spot, they will get their
>> evidence. 
>
>Sinai pretty much has 1 way in.  Then they wandered down to
>Mt. Sinai, the route there is pretty obvious.  Then back
>along the sea and eventually to canaan.  So the diggers knew
>where to start looking.

We  don't know all the things God did for them. If I recall correctly,
God provided water from a rock. Thus there would be drinking
containers laying around here and there, unless God provided temp
vessels. We just don't know.

>
>2 million people is a big mobile city.  Where did they hunt
>and poop and cook and cut firewood and bake pottery?

See above.
>
>Moses died on Mt Nebo.  That pretty much narrows it down
>where they entered Canaan.
>
>
>> >The exodus never happened.
>> 
>> Then there should be millions of Hebrews living in Egypt today.
>
>They were never there.
>
>There is, however, archaeological evidence that the pyramids
>were built by highly skilled, well paid craftsmen who
>consumed a lot of bread and beer.  The builders were not
>slaves.

How do you know those things above were needed?

>
>
>> >> >> >God appeared to Abraham (Gen 18)
>> >> >> >Jacob saw God (Gen 32)
>> >> >> >Moses spoke with God face to face, as to a 
>> >> >> >	friend (Ex 33:11)
>> >> >> >Moses, Aaron & 70 elders saw God (Ex 24)
>> >> >> >God shows Moses his butt (Ex 33:23)
>> >> >> >   As illustrated by Michelangelo on the ceiling 
>> >> >> >   of the Sistine Chapel:
>> >> >> ><https://www.dailyartmagazine.com/michelangelo-warrior-pope-and-gods-bottom/>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>  
>> >> >> See above.
>> >
>> >God spoke to Moses face to face, or the scripture lies. Using
>> >angel intermediaries is not face to face.

Yes, I know it sounds contradictory. Real face to face talking to God
would be suicide, because the Bible in the NT said the angels
delivered the 10 commandments.

In the OT, it says seeing God kills you.

What is going to happen
in the many tomorrows?
Go to: jw.org (8/25/2026)
[email protected]
+

>
>Ok.
>
>> >> >> >Who did Mary and Mary Magdalene see at Jesus's tomb?
>
>Covered elsewhere.
>
>
>> Only looks that way on the surface. But dig under the surface, and you
>> may be surprised on what you find.
>
>Denial ain't just a river in the Sinai.
>
>(snip geneology, which appears contradictory)
>
>> >> >You are thinking God made physics.  I think Nature did. 
>> >> 
>> >> Yet 'nature', like evolution, has no brain! Yet it conjured up all the
>> >> forces to be used in a certain mathematical way to produce the
>> >> complicated laws of physics?? People put a lot of stock in random
>> >> chance. 
>> >
>> >So?
>> >
>> >Is it a surprise that a universe would have natural laws that
>> >function, well, universally?  That's not evidence for God,
>> >only evidence for (as far as we know) consistent natural
>> >laws.
>> 
>> All laws come from somewhere. They just didn't pop out of the vacuum
>> of space. 
>
>How do you know that?  It probably makes sense to you, but
>there's no reason to assume it.
>
>
>> >This is the fallacy of argument from ignorance; you don't
>> >understand how natural laws can exist without God, therefore
>> >they can't.
>> 
>> The laws of physics are mathmatically sound. How can something with no
>> brain, produce them?
>
>Why did natural laws require a brain, or consciousness, to
>exist?
>
>Why is pi not 3?  Why is the earth rock and not chocolate ice
>cream?
>
>
>> So you believe a force with no mind and an IQ of zero, created super
>> complex things like the human brain? Now who is being silly.
>
>Yes, almost certainly.
>
>You deny that it's possible, but you can't articulate why
>it's impossible, other than saying it's implausible and
>silly.
>
>
>> >There was no canopy of water storing floodwaters for noah's
>> >flood.
>> 
>> Are you so sure? 
>> 
>> "In a study published Thursday in Science, researchers present new
>> evidence that Earth has had its water since the very beginning -- no
>> asteroids required."
>> (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2015/11/13/ancient-volcanic-rocks-suggest-that-earths-water-arrived-surprisingly-early/)
>> 
>> For example, this article appeared in the New Scientist magazine, Jan
>> 3, 2009. The first few paragraphs state:
>> 
>> "Ancient Earth was a barren waterworld 
>
>How long earth has had water is irrelevant.  Noah's flood
>would have been ~4000 years ago.  Where did the water come
>from and where did it go?
>
>
>> Until around 2.5 billion years
>
>Irrelevant.
>
>> "NEW VIEW of the young earth covered in oceans of liquid water as
>> early as 4.4 billion years ago contrasts sharply with the hot, hostile
>> world typically depicted in textbooks." (Scientific
>> American)(http://geotest.tamu.edu/userfiles/GEOL106/CoolEarlyEarthSciAm2005.pdf)
>> 
>> Thus, scientists are knowingly or unknowingly, supporting the Genesis
>> account of creation. If this turns out to be accepted as fact, how
>
>It doesn't support Genesis.  You just admitted the earth is
>at least 4.4 billion years old.  So much for Creation.
>
>> could the Genesis writer have known about such things? You might be
>> amazed at how scientifically accurate the Genesis creation account is,
>> once you investigate it. 
>
>Days and nights happening before the sun was created?
>Earth created before the sun & stars?
>Firmament?
>
>
>> The weight of water has everything to do with it. 
>> 
>> As the facts tell us, Venus is surrounded by surfuric acid clouds.
>> SULFURIC ACID IS ABOUT TWICE AS HEAVY AS WATER, PER GALLON. Yet it
>> still is found in its atmosphere! So logically the lighter water
>> physically could have surrounded the earth at one early time.
>
>You do understand that the surface of Venus is 900°F, right?
>The water and sulfuric acid are gasses.
>
>Again, if the earth had another 29,000 ft of water above the
>surface, the surface pressure would be thousands of PSI, and
>the water would block all sunlight.
>
>> >> >(round earth hanging etc)
>> >> >> >> So in summary we have:
>
>Covered elsewhere.  To recap, you have Job saying earth hangs
>and Isaiah saying it's round, which could be round/flat or
>round/spheroid.  You also have a multitude of verses in OT
>and new using descriptions like "immovable", foundation,
>suggesting you can see the whole world from top of an
>exceeding high mountain.
>
>My conclusion: mostly flat-earth geocentric cosmology.
>YMMV.
>
>> >> The book of Job, around the 15th century BCE. ("hangs the earth upon
>> >> nothing"). How would sheepherders of all people, know such things?
>> >
>> >No, Job is about a thousand years later than that.
>> 
>> "Writer: Moses
>> Place Written: Wilderness
>> Writing Completed: c. 1473 B.C.E."
>> (All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial)
>
>AI Overview                 Scholars estimate that the Book
>of Job was written between the 7th and 4th centuries BCE,
>primarily during the Babylonian or Persian periods, though
>the setting of the story depicts an earlier patriarchal era.
>
>
>Most of the OT was oral tradition, finally written down a lot
>later than most believers realize.