Re: The Holy Bible

[email protected] wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Aug 2026 20:42:04 -0700, Samuel Spade <[email protected]> wrote:
> >[email protected] wrote:
> >> On Sun, 02 Aug 2026 00:35:54 -0700, Samuel Spade <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >[email protected] wrote:

(snip old stuff)

> >> >The bible has many contradictions.
> >> 
> >> Give me an example. What you call a contradiction may fade away once
> >> you investigate. 
> >
> >No man can see God and live (Ex 33:20)
> >but:
> 
> Good examples. I don't blame you for calling them contradictions.
> The answer is that sometimes angels represent God. This is not a cop
> out. It's just the BIBLE'S way of talking in places. For example,
> 
> Who gave Moses the 10 commandments? Of course God you say. And I agree
> when I read it. But note what the disciple Luke wrote:
> 
> -- Revised Standard
> Acts 7:53  you who received the law as delivered by angels and did not
> keep it."  
> 
> Thus angels stood for God, and gave the 10 commanments to Moses.
> Remember, the Bible was not written in our century, but is thousands
> of years old. Thus the wording of some ideas can be somewhat
> different.

This is your belief, and i don't doubt that it's quite
biblical.  As a historical matter, it's doubtful whether
Moses even existed, and archaeological evidence (or lack
thereof) suggested the exodus never happened, and that there
were no large numbers of Jews enslaved in Egypt.

That's a different discussion, just sayin'.


> >God appeared to Abraham (Gen 18)
> >Jacob saw God (Gen 32)
> >Moses spoke with God face to face, as to a 
> >	friend (Ex 33:11)
> >Moses, Aaron & 70 elders saw God (Ex 24)
> >God shows Moses his butt (Ex 33:23)
> >   As illustrated by Michelangelo on the ceiling 
> >   of the Sistine Chapel:
> ><https://www.dailyartmagazine.com/michelangelo-warrior-pope-and-gods-bottom/>
> >
>  
> See above.
> 
> >Who did Mary and Mary Magdalene see at Jesus's tomb?
> 
> Show me the Scriptures you are referring to.

Matthew: They saw an angel.
Mark: a man.
Luke: two men.
John: two angels.

> >How did Judas die?
> 
> Please show me the Scriptures you are referring to.
> 
> I did recall a couple of Scriptures was needed to get to the truth. 
> Judas hanged himself over a cliff.  Then the rope broke and he fell
> spilling his guts out. But show me what you think.

Matthew 27:5 Judas hanged himself.
Acts 1:18  Judas fell and his guts burst out.

Two separate narratives.


> >Also from a previous post by Mitchell Holman:
> >194 Contradictions in the New Testament
> ><https://www.slideshare.net/salehusman585/194-contradiction-sin-the-new-testament-of-the-bible>
> 
> If you want to give them to me one at a time, I will comment on them.
> I do recall a couple of Scriptures that Bible scholars say was copiest
> errors in the OT. It had to do with quantaties. (like 1000 chariots,
> or 10,000 chariots)

You can see them for yourself.  How bout the first one,:
"1.  Jesus' lineage was traced through David's son Solomon.
Mt1:6.
     Jesus' lineage was traced through David's son Nathan.
Lk3:31"


(...)
> >Orbital mechanics.  Newton explained the physics of why
> >bodies orbit 300 years ago.  Nothing needed to "support"
> >anything.
> 
> Who made the physics that Newton discovered? So to answer you in your
> nomanclature, God made the "orbital mechanics" that keeps the earth
> stable. (Gen 1:1)

You are thinking God made physics.  I think Nature did. Some,
like Einstein, believed Spinoza's concept of an impersonal
God who was the embodiment of the natural laws of the
universe, and kept the universe following the laws.

Whatever your POV, the discovery and theory of natural laws
is science.  Who "created" natural laws is a question of
religion.

> >(snip flat-earth verses),
> 
> As I said, the BIBLE shows a spherical earth floating in space
> attached to nothing. (Isa 40:22; Job 26:7) Yes, unbelievers want to
> ignore that proof of Bible wisdom.
> 
> >but note this one:
> >
> >> >> >2 Peter 3:5
> >> >> >For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice
> >> >> >that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago
> >> >> >and the earth was formed out of water and by water,
> >> >> 
> >> >> Yes, I agree with all the Scriptures. What was your point?
> >> >
> >> >That the authors of the bible had a flat-earth, geocentric
> >> >cosmology.  And they said earth was formed out of water.
> >> 
> >> Water? Not that I ever read. When it was created, it had a lot of
> >> water associated with it. But wasn't made FROM water. 
> >
> >I just quoted it above. The earth was formed out of water and
> >by water, 2 Pete 3:5.
> 
> (2 Peter 3:5) For they deliberately ignore this fact, that long ago
> there were heavens and an earth standing firmly out of water and in
> the midst of water by the word of God; (NWT)

Plausible, but hard to fit into that box.  NWT and NIV give
different understandings.

> That means there was a lot of water on the earth, and a water canapy
> above the earth. (high in the atmosphere) It was like Venus looks
> today, except their clouds surrounding it are made up of sulfuric
> acid, etc, instead of the earth's water vapor.
> (I surely won't be sunbathing on Venus)

Canopy of water over earth is impossible.  We're talking
29,000 feet of water being stored in the atmosphere.  The
pressure would be greater than at the bottom of the ocean.
All that water (or vapor) would block the sunlight from
earth.  The water would displace all the O2.

This is sometimes used as a what-if for Noah's flood.  It
just doesn't work.


(round earth hanging etc)
> >> So in summary we have:
> >> 
> >> A spherical earth hanging in space by nothing. 
> >> 
> >> Not bad for B.C.E. sheepherders!
> >
> >Again, by the time most of the OT was written down, it was
> >already widely known that the earth was round.  Certainly the
> >Greeks knew it when they translated the Septuagint.
> 
> How do you know?

Because they were educated greeks from Alexandria, a center
of learning.  They knew that Aristotle proved the earth was
round in 400 BCE, and that Eristosthenes measured &
calculated the size of the earth in 240 BCE.

> 
> But there is part B. God hanged the earth upon nothing.Did the B.CE
> Greeks know that also? I do know that Aristotle teachings back then
> taught that things in the sky, like stars, moon, etc, had to be
> hanging from something.

No they didn't know.  And the bodies don't really "hang", but
it's close.  Even Ptolomy in 300 AD thought everything went
around the earth.  The heliocentric model wasn't accepted
until after Copernicus and Galileo, in the 1500s.

> 
> "Planets, the sun, the moon, and the stars were thought to be
> physically pinned like jewels into transparent, rotating concentric
> orbs centered on the Earth." (Aristotle teaching)
> 
> Aristotle said nature abhors a vacuum. Thus all of outerspace had to
> be filled with things. (AI Overview)

Gravity keeps space from filling up.  The vacuum wins.

> >Thank you for your replies, James, I appreciate your time,
> >effort and explanations.
> 
> Thank you for your beliefs.