Re: CMake on Unix

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On 13. 5. 26 22:53, Noel Butler wrote:
>
> On 13/05/2026 07:25, Branko Čibej wrote:
>
>> On 12. 5. 26 22:43, Noel Butler wrote:
>>>
>>> On 13/05/2026 02:08, Timofei Zhakov wrote:
>>>
>>>     I will be happy to try and extend cmake to work on Unix, if this
>>>     feature is wanted of course.
>>>
>>> -1
>>>
>>> cmake is a PITA on *nix   for server admins
>>>
>>
>> While I agree in principle that CMake is fundamentally broken and 
>> wrong-headed, that case can be made for pretty much any generic build 
>> system. So I would be grateful if you would expand on why server 
>> admins in particular would be more affected than anyone else.
>>
>> -- Brane
>>
>
> Its convoluted. Its messy.
>
> Lets take sql as a horrid example (but its similar with the only other 
>  forced cmake requirement that we use being clamav), what used to 
> configured and built with autotools could be done as such, clear 
> simple EASY for even the most junior and senior administrator alike to 
> config from memory -
>
> ./configure --prefix=/usr --localstatedir=/usr/mysql/data 
> --datadir=/var/lib/mysql
>
>
> done...
>
>
> BUT cmake to do same thing requires this crap (supplied my mariadb 
> team member to mimic our build requirements)
>
>
> cmake -DCMAKE_C_FLAGS="-O2 -fPIC" -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-O2 -fPIC" 
> -DFEATURE_SET="community" -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr -D
> INSTALL_LIBDIR="lib64" -DINSTALL_SBINDIR=libexec 
> -DINSTALL_INCLUDEDIR=include/mysql -DINSTALL_MYSQLSHAREDIR=share/mysql
> -DINSTALL_SQLBENCHDIR="" -DINSTALL_MYSQLTESTDIR=mysql-test 
> -DINSTALL_MANDIR=man -DINSTALL_PLUGINDIR="lib64/mysql/plugin"
>  -DINSTALL_SCRIPTDIR=bin -DINSTALL_SUPPORTFILESDIR=share/mysql 
> -DINSTALL_MYSQLDATADIR="/var/lib/mysql" -DMYSQL_DATADIR="
> /var/lib/mysql" -DMYSQL_UNIX_ADDR="/var/run/mysql/mysql.sock" 
> -DWITH_EXTRA_CHARSETS=complex -DWITH_INNOBASE_STORAGE_ENGI
> NE=1 -DENABLED_LOCAL_INFILE=ON -DWITH_LIBARCHIVE=ON -DWITH_READLINE=ON 
> -DWITH_JEMALLOC=system -DWITH_ZLIB=system -DWITH_
> EXTERNAL_ZLIB=ON -DWITH_SSL=system -DCONC_WITH_SSL=ON 
> -DUSE_ARIA_FOR_TMP_TABLES=ON -DAWS_SDK_EXTERNAL_PROJECT=OFF
>
> Then  running    make...
>
> *THEN* to upgrade each version you have to screw around with garbage like
>
> rm $(</root/install_manifest-MARIADB.txt)
> make install
> cp install_manifest.txt /root/install_manifest-MARIADB.txt
>
> (Sure you don't need to cp and use /root/install_manifest but if 
> someone clears out the source code you will be left with pieces of 
> older versions, so you copy it, and lets not forget  that file is not 
> created until the program is built and installed, its not something 
> you can pluck out of a tarball
>
> all because there is no make uninstall....
>
>
>
> And clamav as mentioned earlier, before it was just
>
> ./configure --prefix=
>
>
> NOW it too requires all the manual rm BS as maria/mysql above, but at 
> least its CMAKE line is much shorter..
>
>
> cmake .. -D CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr/local -D 
> CMAKE_INSTALL_LIBDIR=lib64 -D APP_CONFIG_DIRECTORY=/etc/clamav -D 
> DATABASE_DIRECTORY=/var/lib/clamav
>
>
> you try remembering all that crap when you need to off the top of your 
> head, and using a cheatsheet (like we obviously are doing) is not an 
> excuse.
>
> I reckon the same morons who are involved in systemd are involved in 
> cmake,  12 lines to do with what cron does in 1
>
>
> /that completes this years rant
>


You just described two horribly broken CMake build systems. In the two 
cases you mentioned, the fault lies with the authors, not with CMake. :)

Well, except in the sense that CMake has zero, nil, zilch, none 
whatsoever sane defaults on ANY platform.

I'm "happy" to say that it's extremely easy to write autotools builds 
that are just as broken as the CMake examples you just described.

-- Brane

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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13. 5. 26 22:53, Noel Butler wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:[email protected]">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <p id="reply-intro">On 13/05/2026 07:25, Branko Čibej wrote:</p>
      <blockquote type="cite"
style="padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2px solid; margin: 0">
        <div id="replybody1">
          <div class="v1moz-cite-prefix">On 12. 5. 26 22:43, Noel Butler
            wrote:</div>
          <blockquote type="cite"
style="padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2px solid; margin: 0">
            <p id="v1reply-intro">On 13/05/2026 02:08, Timofei Zhakov
              wrote:</p>
            <blockquote
style="padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2px solid; margin: 0;">
              <div id="v1replybody1">
                <div dir="ltr">
                  <div> </div>
                  <div>I will be happy to try and extend cmake to work
                    on Unix, if this feature is wanted of course.</div>
                  <div> </div>
                  <span class="v1v1gmail_signature_prefix"></span></div>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
            <p>-1</p>
            <p>cmake is a PITA on *nix   for server admins</p>
          </blockquote>
          <br>
          While I agree in principle that CMake is fundamentally broken
          and wrong-headed, that case can be made for pretty much any
          generic build system. So I would be grateful if you would
          expand on why server admins in particular would be more
          affected than anyone else.<br>
          <br>
          -- Brane<br>
          <br>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>Its convoluted. Its messy.</p>
      <p>Lets take sql as a horrid example (but its similar with the
        only other  forced cmake requirement that we use being clamav),
        what used to configured and built with autotools could be done
        as such, clear simple EASY for even the most junior and senior
        administrator alike to config from memory -</p>
      <p>./configure --prefix=/usr --localstatedir=/usr/mysql/data
        --datadir=/var/lib/mysql </p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>done...</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>BUT cmake to do same thing requires this crap (supplied my
        mariadb team member to mimic our build requirements)</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>cmake -DCMAKE_C_FLAGS="-O2 -fPIC" -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-O2 -fPIC"
        -DFEATURE_SET="community" -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr -D<br>
        INSTALL_LIBDIR="lib64" -DINSTALL_SBINDIR=libexec
        -DINSTALL_INCLUDEDIR=include/mysql
        -DINSTALL_MYSQLSHAREDIR=share/mysql <br>
        -DINSTALL_SQLBENCHDIR="" -DINSTALL_MYSQLTESTDIR=mysql-test
        -DINSTALL_MANDIR=man -DINSTALL_PLUGINDIR="lib64/mysql/plugin"<br>
         -DINSTALL_SCRIPTDIR=bin -DINSTALL_SUPPORTFILESDIR=share/mysql
        -DINSTALL_MYSQLDATADIR="/var/lib/mysql" -DMYSQL_DATADIR="<br>
        /var/lib/mysql" -DMYSQL_UNIX_ADDR="/var/run/mysql/mysql.sock"
        -DWITH_EXTRA_CHARSETS=complex -DWITH_INNOBASE_STORAGE_ENGI<br>
        NE=1 -DENABLED_LOCAL_INFILE=ON -DWITH_LIBARCHIVE=ON
        -DWITH_READLINE=ON -DWITH_JEMALLOC=system -DWITH_ZLIB=system
        -DWITH_<br>
        EXTERNAL_ZLIB=ON -DWITH_SSL=system -DCONC_WITH_SSL=ON
        -DUSE_ARIA_FOR_TMP_TABLES=ON -DAWS_SDK_EXTERNAL_PROJECT=OFF</p>
      <p>Then  running    make...</p>
      <p><strong>THEN</strong> to upgrade each version you have to screw
        around with garbage like</p>
      <p>rm $(&lt;/root/install_manifest-MARIADB.txt)<br>
        make install<br>
        cp install_manifest.txt /root/install_manifest-MARIADB.txt</p>
      <p>(Sure you don't need to cp and use /root/install_manifest but
        if someone clears out the source code you will be left with
        pieces of older versions, so you copy it, and lets not forget
         that file is not created until the program is built and
        installed, its not something you can pluck out of a tarball</p>
      <p>all because there is no make uninstall....</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>And clamav as mentioned earlier, before it was just</p>
      <p>./configure --prefix=</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>NOW it too requires all the manual rm BS as maria/mysql above,
        but at least its CMAKE line is much shorter..</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>cmake .. -D CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr/local -D
        CMAKE_INSTALL_LIBDIR=lib64 -D APP_CONFIG_DIRECTORY=/etc/clamav
        -D DATABASE_DIRECTORY=/var/lib/clamav</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>you try remembering all that crap when you need to off the top
        of your head, and using a cheatsheet (like we obviously are
        doing) is not an excuse.</p>
      <p>I reckon the same morons who are involved in systemd are
        involved in cmake,  12 lines to do with what cron does in 1</p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <p>/that completes this years rant</p>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <br>
    You just described two horribly broken CMake build systems. In the
    two cases you mentioned, the fault lies with the authors, not with
    CMake. :)<br>
    <br>
    Well, except in the sense that CMake has zero, nil, zilch, none
    whatsoever sane defaults on ANY platform.<br>
    <br>
    I'm "happy" to say that it's extremely easy to write autotools
    builds that are just as broken as the CMake examples you just
    described.<br>
    <br>
    -- Brane<br>
    <br>
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