paul:
it sounds like your idea of openness in communities (particularly with
that word in their title) corresponds most closely with george
w. bush's "open town meetings", where his supporters ask potential
attendees to sign loyalty oaths, to better screen out people who might
disagree by attending and, god forbid, asking "hard" questions.
(possible corollary to godwin's law developing here).
byrne's original question (and his tasteful silence following your
posting) has not at all been disruptive of the business of this list.
i urge byrne to follow up to the list a summary of what he found out
(or a link to what he might write about the subject elsewhere in
friendlier venues).
your unpleasant suggestion, on the other hand, and your followups
attacking byrne's unworthy learning methods (subscribing to other
open lists to find out about the subject, gosh) has added nothing to
this list or to the world, so now i propose we end discussion of the
subject by pretending it never happened.
but here i think it's appropriate to include a little posting from a
few days ago by jonathan spira on the subject of dave farber's IP
list, and how these things *can* work.
------- Original message -------
From: Jonathan B Spira <[email protected]>
Sent: 1/4/'05, 9:48
Dave, a recent exchange of e-mails following a posting on the IP list
resulted in my column this week, which I think you and other IPers may
find of interest.
If I haven't said it in a while, thanks for the IP list. It is truly a gift.
/s/ Jonathan
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BASEX:COMMENTARY-OF-THE-WEEK BY JONATHAN B. SPIRA
THE INTERNET, AS IT WAS
For a moment - and it was just a moment in the passage of time - I was
transported back to the early days of the Internet, when a pioneering
spirit of friendliness and cooperation was the norm.
Let me explain how this happened.
The last section to be written for my book, Managing the Knowledge
Workforce: Understanding the Information Revolution That's Changing
the Business World, is a timeline on knowledge and information work.
David Goldes (Basex' president) and I had actually started researching
this in 1990, and we published it that year. The original 1990
timeline had 20 entries, starting with the invention of paper (105)
and the pencil (1465), continuing with the typewriter (1808), the
computer (ENIAC, 1946), and the floppy disk (1970). I decided to
include it - with additional entries - in the book. My augmented
timeline has ca. 70 entries, start ing with ink (2697 B.C.E.) and
continuing with the alphabet (ca. 1600 B.C.E.), including the codex
(first century C.E.), the wireless telegraph (1792, Chappe Semaphore),
and the graphical user interface (1975). My criteria for
inclusion included its significance to knowledge and information work,
and whether it qualified as a "first" [e.g. the FIRST fountain pen
(1702) made it in, but Lewis Waterman's commercially successful
version a century later did not].
What I didn't have was a firm fix on the first office telephone
system, or Private Branch eXchange (PBX). I had a vague recollection
about a Midwestern retirement home having the first PBX but none of my
searches proved fruitful. Not the type to give up, I e-mailed my
friend Dave Farber, a founding father of the Internet and proprietor
of the IP redistribution and commentary mailing list, asking him to
send my enquiry on to the 30,000 or so IP readers (IP stands for
Interesting Persons). (Wired magazine once called Dave the "Paul
Revere" of the Internet.)
No sooner had I clicked on send, than my in box started to fill up.
First, Katie Hafner, who writes for the New York Times, promised to
look this up in her copy of John Brooks' "Telephone: The First 100
Years" when she got home. Mark Seiden pointed me to two possible
"firsts" - one of which was the Old Soldiers' Home in Dayton Ohio
(1878). Half a dozen other IPers also e-mailed me, some asking
questions to narrow the scope of my enquiry; others recommending
places to look for further info.
Esther Dyson chimed in and introduced me via e-mail to Tom Malone, a
professor at MIT who she felt would know the answer.
For a moment - and it really was just a moment - I thought of a few
mailing lists of the early 1990s where pioneering Internet users were
doling out their expertise left and right. No banner adverts, no
commercialization, just people helping people. But it was just a
moment.
Jonathan B. Spira is CEO and Chief Analyst at Basex. He can be reached at [email protected]
/=================== http://www.basex.com/advance ===================\
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Managing the Knowledge Workforce
Understanding the Information Revolution
That's Changing the Business World
by Jonathan B. Spira
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Special pre-publication pricing $29.99 including free shipping
Click on http://www.basex.com/advance for a peek inside
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Editorial Director: Basilio Alferow
Contributors: David M. Goldes,
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All data, opinions, and projections are based on Basex' judgment at
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On Sat, Apr 02, 2005 at 10:33:11PM -0500, Paul D. Bain wrote:
> Michael,
>
> Do you know how Tony Byrne learned of the Fedora Project? He learned
> of it from me. I mentioned Fedora on another CMS mailing list
> ([email protected]) just a few weeks ago, after an OSS CMS
> developer (Olli Aro) asked the members of that list to identify an OSS
> _document_ management system. And Byrne subscribes to that mailing list,
> too, just as I do.
>
> -- Paul Bain
> >
> >>Tony Byrne - CMS Watch wrote:
> >>
>
> >>>Someone stumped me recently by asking whether I knew of any open-source
> >>>DAM projects. I've heard of fedora (http://www.fedora.info/) and know
> >>>that some people
> >>>use traditional CM packages (like Zope) for basic media asset
> >>>management. Am I missing any other ones with reasonably wide support?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Tony, let me refresh your memory. Fewer than two years ago, on
> >>your web site (www.CMSwatch.com), you disparaged open source (OS)
> >>CMS's, saying that they were _all_ inferior as compared to proprietary
> >>CMS's and that no one should consider using a OS CMS. Now, I see that
> >>you are asking for help from those who use and develop OS CMS's. You
> >>are asking for help from those people whose work you have disparaged!
> >>I am amazed that someone who disparages OS software would have the
> >>effrontery to ask for help from the OS community. Your effrontery
> >>amazes me.
> >>
> >> I sincerely hope that no one on this list will give you any help
> >>whatsoever. Get your damned ass back to CMSwatch and that mailing list
> >>for the mentally retarded, [email protected] The participants
> >>on that mailing list _love_ proprietary software, just as you do, and
> >>for the same reason: you and they are morons.
> >>
> >> Please, folks, do NOT help Tony Byrne. He is an enemy of the OS
> >>community and a damned bastard.
> >>
> >>Sincerely,
> >>Paul Bain
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