Re: [Tiki-devel] Problem with french translation for "Location"

You can "translate" the lang/en/language.php by editing the array of 
translation strings there too.

On 26.01.2021 14:58, Dr. Sassafras wrote:
> If the English string was changed to add a modifier, wouldn't this break the English view? I think we're looking at a coding change to accommodate this somehow.
>
> I also think we need to think about if the context is added to the string, or assigned to the “tr” tag. Eg. {tr context=day}M{/tr}. Someone needs to figure out what is going to be faster as we're dealing with regex here and it can be taxing. We're also looking at something that happens on every page, sometimes hundreds of times. I suspect that adding the modifier to the tag will be more efficient, but I would need to look at the code to make a good judgement call on this.
>
> Brendan
>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 7:23 AM, Jonny Bradley via TikiWiki-devel <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> I think this is something for 23.x, not in stable branches until it's properly tested (it will need changes all over the place imho).
>>
>> jb
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 26 Jan 2021, at 11:21, luciash via TikiWiki-devel <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, I would do it after the release. Too late to do it either way now (sadly) I guess.
>>>
>>> You need to run the script from Brendan then to fix all the languages after making the change in tpls iirc.
>>>
>>> luci
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 26.01.2021 12:08, Bsfez Tiki wrote:
>>>> To be sure I get it righ (and thanks for helping me to understand)t;
>>>>
>>>> at : lang/fr/language.php
>>>>
>>>> I change;
>>>> "Location" => "Lieu",
>>>>
>>>> for
>>>>
>>>> "Location_(map)" => "Lieu",
>>>>
>>>> And at : templates/tiki-user_preferences.tpl line 99
>>>>
>>>> I change
>>>>
>>>> {tr}Location{/tr}
>>>>
>>>> for
>>>>
>>>> {tr}Location_(map){/tr}
>>>>
>>>> Ok...
>>>>
>>>> But this will break translation for ALL the string "Location" in every language.
>>>> And meaning is I should change each occurence of
>>>>
>>>> {tr}Location{/tr}
>>>> and eventually:
>>>> {tr}location{/tr}
>>>> tra('Location')
>>>> tra('location')
>>>>
>>>> Then rebuilt the language strings.
>>>>
>>>> That look like an "Adventurous" change/commit just before a release.🤔
>>>>
>>>> Bernard
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 26 Jan 2021, at 11:45 , luciash via TikiWiki-devel <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> What should be done to implement it: I guess just go ahead and change the strings in tpl files then translate in language.php?
>>>>>
>>>>> luci
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 26.01.2021 10:13, Bsfez Tiki via TikiWiki-devel wrote:
>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> While I’m looking in the translations I have to merge I found that issue we previously discussed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Seems we add a kind of solution:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "edit (verb)": modifier
>>>>>>> "edit (noun)": modification
>>>>>>> "D_(day)" => "D", (in english)
>>>>>>> "D_(day)" => "J" (in french)
>>>>>>> "Location_(map)" => "Lieu" (in french)
>>>>>>> "Rent" => "Location" (in french)
>>>>>>> "Location" (in a tracker dropdown) stays "Location"
>>>>>> What should be done to implement it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I (and I see others here and there) have commented/broken translations in French because of this).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bernard
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 10 Nov 2020, at 15:02 , [email protected] wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't remember a specific example in Tiki off hand, but there are also examples of a term in English that has many translations.. Something like:
>>>>>>> "edit (verb)": modifier
>>>>>>> "edit (noun)": modification
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marc
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, 9 Nov 2020 12:31:53 +0000 Tiki developers [email protected] said
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Probably "if i remember correctly"? (guessing from
>>>>>>>> https://www.acronymfinder.com/Slang/IIRC.html ;)
>>>>>>>> But i don't remember that suggestion i'm afraid, but it's a good one. In the past we've discussed more structural ways of adding a content - like
>>>>>>>> by making the strings in the templates into constant looking tokens (like
>>>>>>>> LOCATION_AS_IN_MAPS) and then completely rebuilding the translation system to
>>>>>>>> take account of this, which has never happened because it would be a huge
>>>>>>>> task, would make the templates extra ugly and unlikely to be funded by
>>>>>>>> clients directly...
>>>>>>>> But Luci's idea could fairly easily by implemented with the small addition of
>>>>>>>> a little test in the tra() function to strip off the trailing _(some text) if
>>>>>>>> no translation is found (preferably not using regular expressions for
>>>>>>>> performance reasons).
>>>>>>>> So for Bernard's other similar question those calendar ones could be
>>>>>>>> "D_(day)", "M_(month)" etc.
>>>>>>>> I like it! :)
>>>>>>>> jb_(jonny)
>>>>>>>>> On 9 Nov 2020, at 11:59, Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside
>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> IIRC ?
>>>>>>>>>> On 2020-11-09 6:23 a.m., luciash via TikiWiki-devel wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Good thinking Polyna, it happened before but it was not so important for
>>>>>>>>> anyone to care. IIRC I proposed something like this (context identifier, e.g.
>>>>>>>>> "Location_(place)", "List_(button)", "List_(title,label)" or "Mine_(my)") for
>>>>>>>>> the translation strings already several years ago.
>>>>>>>>>>>> luci
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 09.11.2020 11:55, Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> But this wouldn't solve your problem !
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It will only push it later on to be fixed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because "Location" that can mean "where something is" remain a possibility
>>>>>>>>> in French, like in English.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But also it can means to offer something for rental.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think it would be something smart to push it a bit further to our mind
>>>>>>>>> finding a solution.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because if this now arise with one keyword, we can be assured this will
>>>>>>>>> appear later on with some different word, maybe in Spanish, Japanese or even
>>>>>>>>> Russian this time...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am surprised this didn't happened before and haven't been think about....
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The pretty simple fact that taking word out of context and translating them
>>>>>>>>> won't do the job on the long run. Don't need a PhD in linguistic to understand
>>>>>>>>> this one ! Neither do you need to have developed a natural language processing
>>>>>>>>> library to start that maybe there's a need to evolve the crude simple string
>>>>>>>>> matching translation...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Those a just my crazy idea... and it's why I implemented some context
>>>>>>>>> identifier to the string, so that I can use unique word in different context
>>>>>>>>> and control how they translate. So that the translation keep a bit of logic.
>>>>>>>>> Sometime, you also have to invert the position of word in sentence. Or it
>>>>>>>>> really look like a 1985 translated text based console video game...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2020-11-09 5:15 a.m., luciash via TikiWiki-devel wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> In such cases we introduce new preference for Trackers on i18n control
>>>>>>>>> panel "Multilingual Tracker field names" to make it optional.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 09.11.2020 9:26, Bsfez Tiki via TikiWiki-devel wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In a French Tiki in a tracker I have a dropdown field and one field value
>>>>>>>>> is "Location" (meaning rent in French)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But it is swapped for the word "Lieu" and that’s a different meaning.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The swapping is a translation.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> At lang/fr/language.php line 2304 we have
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Location" => "Lieu",
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Location exist in French and as a different meaning than in English
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How do we deal with such cases ?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> B
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>> Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.tiki.org/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Be smart, Be wise, Own your information infrastructure
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>> -- > Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.tiki.org/
>>>>>>>>>>> -Be smart, Be wise, Own your information infrastructure
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> TikiWiki-devel mailing list
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