RE: the sitemap explained [was: Re: [Wyonacms- users] Creating new pages with wyona - Getting organised]

Hi Kevin, hi List,

thank you for your thoughts about this. Allthough, I agree with you, 
that it doesn't make sense, to write an other documentation about 
cocoon and it's usage (a good link list will do a better job :-)). On 
the other hand, I think, that we have to explain on a very low level 
the fundamental concepts of cocoon (pipeline, sitemap et cetera), and 
to point out some details in the planned examples. Otherwise the 
examples aren't of much help.

rgds

Markus

>I think this cocoon specific material should be second priority. For the
>short term, a list of which things are cocoon concepts, and maybe a pointer
>to the cocoon website AND the books will have to do. Once the wyona specific
>items are explained, then work could be done to import copies of
>explanations from cocoon.
>
>Kevin McCarthy
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Markus Vaterlaus [mailto:[email protected]]
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 8:08 PM
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [Wyonacms-users] the sitemap explained [was: Re:
>[Wyonacms-users] Creating new pages with wyona - Getting organised]
>
>
>Hello Thosten, hello list,
>
>as the sitemap is the central element of cocoon, there might be a
>thousand questions around. I the following questions are the first
>that arise, if a newbie sees the sitemap
>
>- what are the different parts of the sitemap good for?
>- the concept of a pipeline explained
>- a matcher explained
>- a "normal" pipeline with its parts explained
>     - a matcher
>         - a generator
>         - a transformer
>         - a serializer
>- a reader explained
>- (and now something completly different:)
>     the wildcards explained
>
>I know, that many of the above is already explained elsewhere (ex. on
>the cocoon-website). However has our newbie read the cocoon website?
>I don't think so... and to keep up with wyona he needs some basic
>knowledge about cocoon and hence the sitemap.
>
>Greetings!
>
>--mv
>
>nb: by replying to this post you are free to shorten the subject-line ;-)
>
>Am 7.11.2002 0:52 Uhr +0100 uebermittelte Thorsten Scherler folgende Zeilen:
>
>>Hello Markus, hello group,
>>
>>I think you're right again. In building an example site from the
>>basic helloworld pub we will learn how wyona is working. I tend to
>>understand things better if I already 've done them myself.
>>
>>So what are e.g. questions that can rise regarding the sitemap.xmap?
>>It is easier to answer question. That way we can generate the
>>tutorials!
>>
>>Markus Vaterlaus wrote:
>>>Am 6.11.2002 19:15 Uhr +0100 uebermittelte Thorsten Scherler folgende
>Zeilen:
>>>
>>>>Hello group,
>>>>
>>>>I think what we need is to start working on the example page.
>>>
>>>
>>>Hi Thorsten, hi list,
>>>
>>>well, that's true, we really should start. Allthough, for me the
>>>question is with what? Starting with an example is a good idea,
>>>however, has the user set sucessfully up tomcat and wyona? Doesn't
>>>he need help with that? Or would it be better to offer him at first
>>>a guided tour trough some predefined examples which don't require a
>>>local set-up? Or wouldn't it be better, if the existing examples
>>>would be described? A load o'Q, a lot o'A...
>>>
>>>So, considering the above questions, all should be answerd by "Y".
>>>Therefore, there  is a lot of work ahead of us and we need an - be
>>>honest: mind-blasting <g> - example and a superb documentation
>>>about all the stuff not explained in the example. Actually my
>>>intention is to provide the project with some basic documentation
>>>(I think there's a lot of work waiting...) and first of all with a
>>>optimized and easy to maintain structure for all these documents
>>>reflecting the needs of all the different users. I personally don't
>>>focus that much on an example (that's important too) than on the
>>>documentation as a whole (how to stuff a lot of different things in
>>>it). However, if you feel like it, go ahead and start with the
>>>building of an example (all functional aspects are definied, aren't
>  >>they?) and note down every step you take. With that, it will be
>>>easier to write the accompaining documentation. How does this sound
>>>to you?
>>>
>>>Markus
>>>
>>>>What Markus said is true. A newbie USER wants to see a publication
>>>>he can configure not develope.
>>>>
>>>>On the on the other hand Felix wants to show DEVELOPER how wyona
>>>>work from ground on.
>>>>
>>>>We have to develop that example site anyway so why not keep a
>>>>record how we did it.
>>>>
>>>>We all agree that wyona needs a better documentation. So if we can
>>>>build a "one size fits all" example site, the user could configure
>>>>the "individual" components (that the developer will create) to it.
>>>>
>>>>I propose the following top level directory structure:
>>>>docs <- all xml, xhtml
>>>>resources <- all other
>>>>stylesheets <- all xsl
>>>>logic <- all xsp
>>>>
>>>>I have never writen a programm in Java. But like cocoon and XML
>>>>very much (not yet an expert ;-).
>>>>How can we get organised?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>><Citation>
>>>>Markus Vaterlaus wrote:
>>>>Hi all,
>>>>Am 25.10.2002 12:06 Uhr +0200 uebermittelte Felix Maeder folgende Zeilen:
>>>>1) static HTML Hello World (only Cocoon)
>>>>2) XML, XSLT Hello World (only Cocoon)
>>>>3) Adding the Wyona Toolbar
>>>>4) Making the Hello World editable with Xopus and Bitflux
>>>>5) Making the Hello World publishable
>>>>6) Making the Hello World creatable (Hello Pluto, Hello Neptun, etc.)
>>>>7) Adding Access Controlling to the Hello World
>>>>
>>>>I don't think this is the best way to go because it takes too long
>>>>until you actually have a working publication. If you are newbie
>>>>and are trying out a new product, you want to *see* something very
>>>>quickly, otherwise you will lose interest pretty soon. I would
>>>>propose a more result-oriented, less didactic approach:
>>>>1. In the distribution there should be a simple "Hello World"
>publication:
>>>>- Simple layout
>>>>- One simple document type (title, subtitles, paragraphs, images,
>>>>maybe a list) which is editable through Xopus and Bitflux
>>>>- A basic navigation
>>>>- Possibility to upload images
>>>>- Possibility to create new pages
>>>>- Possibility to publish pages
>>>>- Basic access controlling with one user/one role/one policy
>>>></Citation>
>>>>
>>>>"Wyona CMS is an Open-Source Content Management and Publishing
>>>>System written in 100% pure Java. It is based on open standards
>>>>such as XML and XSLT. One of its core components is Cocoon from
>>>>the Apache Software Foundation." http://www.wyona.org
>>>>
>>>>Thorsten Scherler
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>WyonaCMS-users mailing list
>>>>[email protected]
>>>>http://mail.wyona.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/wyonacms-users
>
>
>--
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>Unglaublich, aber wahr: Dilbert lebt!
>
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Unglaublich, aber wahr: Dilbert lebt!

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