R: R: Abominations, schedule & Euler angles

Benoit,
    I would like to specify that there is no "pro/against Oliver" in my
considerations.

As I told before, whichever the decision will be, that one will be accepted.
It seemed to me that Oliver wrote he was thinking about it.... Just my 2
cents... I was not complaining!!
Ciao and Merry Christmas
    Carmine
  -----Messaggio originale-----
  Da: Benoit Pothier [mailto:[email protected]]
  Inviato: mercoledi 24 dicembre 2003 14.09
  A: [email protected]
  Oggetto: Re: R: [webots-contest] Abominations, schedule & Euler angles


  I disagree, here is my point of view, simply because I am reading 2
reactions
  against Olivier proposal:

  I agree with the fact than the model should be changed a bit. I am not
against
  diving, but robots shouln't be able to stand up so easily, in a non
realistic
  way.  Why? I would simply give a more interesting/challenging contest.
Last
  year rules have been changed to prevent robots from loading multiple times
on
  the same feeder and that was a very good thing. Controllers based on this
  strategy had to be adapted. Olivier can't think about strategies spoiling
the
  contest interest before they are created. And so, rules have to be changed
  during the contest. Competitors should rely on sensors and not on
  trials/errors and manual servo positionning to build their robots. This
way
  they would easily adapt themselves to new rules or models.

  I hope than the joint limit and the friction factor ajustements will be
  suffisant to prevent fast-recovery. Because, the force of the joints is
not so
  important : it is allready difficult to jump.

  --
  Benoit


  * fransklip <[email protected]> [031223 15:29]:
  > Good reply, Caramine
  >
  > Here is 1 cent from me too.
  >
  > A spectator, who obviously has not tried to make a two-legged robot
  > walk, cannot appreciate the work and thinking and testing that has
  > gone into just making a two-legged robot move purpously. (his "name"
  > came from just hitting the middle row of keys at the left side "asdfg"
  > a couple of times, he liked to be anonymous obviously.)
  > Also this contest runs for many months and the "diving" is just one of
  > the things that came up. It will go again, because amoungst the top
  > ranking robots it is not decisive anymore.
  > I added the dive to my robot becaus I programmed it for my "sparring
  > partner" judoka to test a defence, and then thought: attack is the
  > best defence, and make it faster then Coyote's. It did work for a few
  > days, then other robots did it better.
  >
  > And about the contest rules:
  >
  > This was a new type of match / robot sport, and the rules had to
  > evolve with the development of the robots. In human sports, rules
  > change too. And I learned to forget about the human form of judo early
  > on in the contest (I have practiced judo 8 years in my teens).
  >
  > It is a wise to think about the newly proposed model changes.
  > There are only 4 months to go. And model changes are much more
  > destructive for controller programs then changes is match rules. It
  > will mean a lot of programming and testing, and a lot of time. Early
  > in the contest there ware two such changes in the model (the floor was
  > slippery like a dancing foor, and the maximum servo speed/force was
  > double the current value of 5), and even now there are some "broken"
  > robots that are not updated for these change.
  >
  > Perhaps it would be wise to leave the proposed drastic changes for the
  > next contest.
  > There is a chance that a number of contenders won't update for this
  > model change, or perhaps don't have the time for it. And the primary
  > interest of the EPFL students stops in January.
  >
  > Another point is, that perhaps some contenders could have some more
  > technical help. The Wiki pages give some, they actually were created
  > as a spin-off from technical discussions on this message board. A
  > second message board perhaps?
  >
  > Frans (Kimaita)



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