Re: can I just encrypt tables? what about the app?

On 29/02/16 21:35, shawn l.green wrote:
>
>
> On 2/29/2016 3:13 PM, Reindl Harald wrote:
>>
>>
>> Am 29.02.2016 um 20:54 schrieb Gary Smith:
>>> On 29/02/2016 19:50, Reindl Harald wrote:
>>>>
>>>> cryptsetup/luks can achieve that way better
>>>>
>>> Only to a degree.
>>
>> no - not only to a degree - when the question is "not 
>> store anything
>> unencrypted on the disk" the is no degree, but or if
>>
>>> Once the disk is unencrypted, you've got access to the
>>> filesystem. If you've got physical access to the 
>>> machine, then anything
>>> which gives you console access gives you (potentially) 
>>> access to the
>>> underlying database files. If you can get those, it's 
>>> trivial to get
>>> access to the dataset that they contain.
>>>
>>> However, if TDE is employed, then you've got another 
>>> significant
>>> obstacle to overcome: The data is only encrypted (aiui) 
>>> once it's in
>>> memory. At this point, you're needing to do attacks on 
>>> RAM to get access
>>> to the data - and even then, you're unlikely to get 3 
>>> bars for a jackpot
>>> payout of the whole database schema, assuming a decent 
>>> sized database.
>>
>> in theory
>>
>> in reality you don't need to hack around in the RAM - 
>> mysqld needs to
>> have access to key for operate with the data and so you 
>> need to find
>> only that piece
>>
>> the same for encryption on the application side before 
>> send data to the
>> db-layer - see the start and subject of that thread how 
>> far people are
>> away from understanding how and on what layer things are 
>> encrypted and
>> what excatly is protected in which context....
>>
>> there is no "turn this on and you are safe" without 
>> deeper understanding
>>
>
> Correct. As long as the key and the lock are on the same 
> machine, there will be some way of opening that lock. It's 
> just a matter of how hard can you make it to find that 
> key. No data is perfectly safe. No crypto is unbreakable. 
> Ever.
>
> Maybe the key only exists in memory while the daemon runs? 
> You can hack the memory to find the key.
>
> Maybe the key is retrieved from another key service 
> daemon. If you have the credentials to impersonate a valid 
> retriever, you are in the money.
>
> The purpose of any encryption system is not to make it 
> impossible to read the data. It's purpose is to make it 
> impractically hard for any unauthorized parties to read it.
taking your last line and making and assumption or two, 
notion of double encryption arises - will it work?


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