Re: Re: Peter still in misery (was: Jan doesn't want Peter to know (was: Peter wants

On Sun, Nov 03, 2002 at 03:25:52PM -0500, Peter D. Ward wrote:
> I guess I too am ready to simply agree-to-disagree.   With regard to
> S/390-land EMULATION, I've seen the following from IBM:
> 1)   patent license ===>software license
> 2)   no patent license ===> no software license

Correlation does not imply causation.

> What you seem to argue is that Herc is eligible for the following:
> 3)  no patent license ====> software license

Unless and until IBM says that the lack of any licensing for any alleged
patents that Hercules may infringe is the reason for refusing to license
their software on Hercules, this is a pretty large leap.

> > I think that you are underestimating the power of open source
> > development here.
> I think not.   Open source development + internet is a powerful
> combination, but Herc could have been done by closed+internet where those
> who you let into a closed view of the source are the same 40 or 50 folks
> you are talkin' about.  (The z/Herc list is after all a closed list of
> about 40 folks according to the yahoo vestibule page at:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/zHercules/) If you went commercial as the
> QPL would allow, my bet is you wouldn't need open source, or even perhaps
> the 40 or 50 guys to maintain it, but you would need the net.

I disagree. Those 40 or 50 guys are on the zHercules list because they
contributed code to the package, and were invited to join as folks who had
shown both an interest in, and the ability to, contribute to the development
of Hercules itself. The only reason the zHercules list is closed is to keep
the discussions there focused on development itself, rather than lots of
other issues. Further, anyone on the zHercules list who asks is given commit
access to the CVS repository. (When I mentioned this to Eric Raymond, he
said that that had proven over many projects to be the most effective way to
manage development of an open source project.) The repository itself is open
for anyone to read from via anonymous CVS.

I firmly believe that, were it not for open source, Hercules would not be
where it is today. Lots of folks have contributed lots of good code,
including more than a few things that none of the original developers would
have come up with. Probably the best example of this is compressed DASD,
something no other IBM emulator (and possibly no other emulator for any
platform) has. I certainly wouldn't have come up with it.

> > John Erhman stated in a conversation about the 64 bit architecture
> > in november 2000 that the zPOP would describe "all elements of the
> > 64 bit architecture".  John has been 100% correct, I have not found
> > anything so far that would indicate otherwise,  nor do I believe
> > that anyone else has.
> Now that our 64-bit architecture implementation is out the door, I asked
> the do-ers about this, and their answer is they don't agree.

It would be interesting to hear what they consider the deficiencies to be,
but somehow I don't think that information will be forthcoming.

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