Re: Accessibility issues in gnome 3.14

Hello,
As pointed out at the nov 13 a11y meeting 
<https://meetbot.gnome.org/a11y-meeting/2014/a11y-meeting.2014-11-13-15.07.html> 
by Juanjo Marin <https://wiki.gnome.org/JuanjoMarin> it turns out my 
keyboard navigation issues are worked around by using ctrl+tab keyboard 
command to skip over a lot of controls at the same level of UI hierarchy 
e.g. I can open gnome contacts, use up and down arrow key to navigate in 
a list. Suddenly I find my-self focused on 10th contact out of 901 
contacts in total. The tab key does not allow me to skip past the list 
of contacts but I can use ctrl+tab in this case.

Thanks and greetings

Peter

On 21.10.2014 at 10:46 Peter Vágner wrote:
> Hello,
> I think we need to file some accessibility related bugs against gnome 
> 3.14.
>
> gnome-control-center
> region pannel
> Accessibility experience is confusing in many areas and some parts are 
> not presented by orca.
> When the Regions and language pannel is open it is rather difficult to 
> guess which UI controls are related. First focusable element is a 
> language item. It is possible to use either tab key or down arrow key 
> to move to the formats item. When pressing the tab key while formats 
> item has focus the button Options gains the system focus. Which item 
> is supposed the button Options bring options for? Formats, language or 
> both? If both depending on the selection then it's extremelly 
> inconvenient to select language and use the keyboard to activate 
> options button. If items language and formats should be interpreted as 
> one list pressing tab key while either of these is in focus should 
> move focus out of the list.
> Pressing the enter key when on the language or formats items causes a 
> new dialog to open which suggest Options button is completelly 
> unrelated to these two. In fact by default the presentation style 
> suggests language and formats items are parts of a list it turns out 
> these are individual items thus my previous assumption that tab key 
> should move out of list does not well suits here and the correct 
> behaviour is fine. It should be considered whether these shouldn't be 
> given some different accessibility role e.g. plain buttons would 
> definatelly clear that for me instantly and I would not have to press 
> the enter key on them in order to figure out whether Options button is 
> related to those entries or not.
> As language or formats items are activated a new dialog is displayed 
> with Cancel and Finish buttons. This also includes the list of all 
> available languages or formats depending on what item has been 
> activated previously. When pressing the enter or space bar while one 
> of these list items are focused caused nothing to happen. It is verry 
> difficult to press the Finnish button and keep the first item selected 
> as moving to other controls by pressing the tab key causes not to 
> immediatelly move out of list. This would be better changed because 
> these entries are for sure part of a single list.
>
> Back to the initial screen of Regions and languages pannel. When 
> navigating around by pressing the tab key there is a list of input 
> sources. Again this appears to be a list of items thus pressing tab 
> key while one of the items are selected should move focus out of the 
> list. Imagine if there were 30 items in this list we would have to 
> press the tab key 30 times in order to reach the unlabelled buttons, 
> Add, Remove and the third button I even don't managed to figure out 
> what it does.
> When the Add button is pressed there is a list of a few items perhaps 
> that coresponds with languages and formats found on the system. 
> However pressing enter or the spacebar when one of these has the focus 
> causes nothing noticeable to happen. Last item is an unlabelled item 
> which brings search when pressed. There is already a bug #737344  
> which says searching for new keyboard layout is slow but again until 
> something is typed to an edit field no results are presented by orca. 
> Perhaps The first list where there are only a few items coresponding 
> with system locales should serve as a filter and some layouts have to 
> be displayed when one of these items are selected. Again it is not 
> possible to navigate comfortably out of that list to preserve the 
> selection thus this is my pure guess how I think this window should be 
> operated.
>
> Now see another view of the gnome-control-center Displays this time.
> In there there is a list of all displays currently attached to the 
> system. I don't currently have an external display connected to my 
> laptop but I am afraid this list may suffer from the rather often seen 
> issue I am tallking about here that tab key does not cause the system 
> focus to shift out of the list.
> When the enter key is pressed on an item coresponding to a working 
> display it is possible to configure display resolution, how the 
> display should be positioned, rotated, mirrored etc. However The 
> control's relation ships are badly broken in this window and I can't 
> figure at all what relates to what. The fact there are many unlabelled 
> buttons even adds a bit more confusion to the overal experience.
> You as a sighted powerfull developer might think this is something 
> visually disabled people don't need to touch at all however I hope 
> there is enough willingness to reconsider this. Sighted user has a 
> chance to verify the settings because he can immediatelly see how the 
> displays are arranged, how windows are displayed over multiple 
> displays etc. Now in order to try being modern and try to integrate 
> well into powerfull HTPC style setup having multiple displays 
> connected into a computer is widelly used feature. If something is 
> reconfigured on a HDMI connected TV or when a new display is connected 
> my previous setup is reset and kind of a new profile is created in the 
> monitors.xml file. That's nice to have feature however I have already 
> found my-self being angry using xrandr, wmctrl and other similar tools 
> from the command line to override the current setup so I am able to 
> keep working on the primary display by using casual stuff such as web 
> browsing, emailing etc and at the same time I can have full screen 
> video or images displayed at the second display connected via HDMI. If 
> I were sighted I would be able to set this in a second through this 
> gnome-control-center pannel. As I am not lucky enough and I am blind I 
> have to resort to editing monitor.xml file by hand, verifying 
> configuration by examining output of various other utilities, 
> restarting GDM, switching back and forth between text console and 
> graphical UI and similar.
>
> The list issues I am mainly tallking about here can also be seen in 
> the privacy pannel.
>
> When the controls are not clearly labelled or when a relations are not 
> verry obvious I like to resort to so called flat review orca feature. 
> I have to note that flat review is not working at a lot of places 
> within gnome-control-center e.g. Notifications, region and language, 
> privacy, keyboard and a lot more.
>
> I am not screaming for this to be fixed as soon as possible I know we 
> are in an opensource world. I am slowly tinkering with the system when 
> I do have some spare time and I think occassionally I might be able to 
> find solution to some of these issues and try to submit fixes. E.G. 
> the following gnome-shell issue #729603.
> The list issue I am tallking a lot about here can also be seen in 
> other modern gnome apps such as gnome contacts, gnome documents and 
> even maybe others. I am afraid this might be a GTK specific issue with 
> one of the new controls. I am not really sure what to enter as a bug 
> description, where to report it etc. It's why I am starting this 
> discussion.
> I expect other visually disabled gnome users and fanns to add more 
> experiences like this so we can better pinpoint possible issues and I 
> expect some knowledgeable person from the a11y team to try to 
> understand what's going on, give some examples on how some of these 
> can be addressed. As I said If I will manage it on my own, I am happy 
> to try submitting some little patches.
>
> Thanks for listening
>
> Greetings
>
> Peter
>

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