Re: opie trademark

[edited and sent again to mailing list]

On Tuesday 29 May 2007 03:30, George France wrote:
> Hello Lorn,
>
> I am not making any claim on the ownership of opie project.  What I said is
> that Lorn Potter may not start a project called opieII. 

You cannot tell me that unless you _own_ that name.
By trying to trademark "Opie", you are telling the world that you own 
that name. You don't. You only hosted a project for us.

> It is confusing
> with opie.  It implies that it is the official opie project that supercedes
> opie. 

It does. hence the "II". What part of "II" don't you get?

> It pissed off opie developers.


I am an opie developer, one of the original core developers. one of the 
last. You trying to trademark our project name has pissed of more opie 
developers than me starting opieII at linuxtogo ever did.


>
> I am not going to debate the history of the opie project with you.  I
> founded handhelds.org.  I have the complete opie history.  You are a late
> comer to the project, that does not have all the facts.

excuse me?! a late comer? I started with Opie in early 2002! Get real. I 
was on irc the moment Jason Perlow thought of the name, and kergoth and 
bipolar started it at an embedded linux hosting site - handhelds.org.


>
> Although I am not a lawyer, in the united states, a trademark comes from
> using a mark in trade, which is known as an unregistered mark.  

so by your thinking, sourceforge.net can trademark names of projects it
hosted.

> You can not 
> register a trademark in the US unless it has been an unregistered mark
> first. Registration is just bow, that gives extra rights like presumptive
> ownship. Opie has been a trademark of handhelds.org, inc for a long long
> time.  

YOU and handelds.org do NOT own "OPIE"!

> Now it is more visible, but nothing new is going on. 

BS!

>
> Stop saying that "George France" has trademarked the name.  Yes my name is
> on the application, because it had to be done that way.  Eventually, you
> will be able to see that the names are actually assigned to Handhelds.org,
> Inc as the paper work gets processed.
>
> If you want to use the opie name, there is a proper way to do it.  Taking
> up on yourself to use opieII is not the way.  To avoid confusion, there is
> now an handhelds.org tradename policy at:
>
>   http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/TrademarkPolicy

You do not own the name Opie. I did not take it upon myself, I asked 
opie core developers, including myself, about it. I also posted to the 
mailing list.

>
>
> --George France
> CEO, Handhelds.org, Inc 501(c)3
>
> On Sunday 13 May 2007 09:22 pm, Lorn Potter wrote:
> > George France wrote:
> > > Hi Lorn,
> > >
> > > Handhelds.org has never used the sourceforge model. It was purposely
> > > designed not to use that model.  It has a complete architecture.  The
> > > firmware works with the kernel, that works with the base distribution,
> > > which works with the gui layer on the top.
> >
> > Essentially, you are saying that you own the projects (at least the
> > name) hosted at handhelds.org. whereby, me and a few other developers
> > who worked on it, actually own it.
> > Handhelds.org is a _hosting_ web site, like sourceforge.net, that hosts
> > projects, like Opie.
> > See this page:
> > http://www.handhelds.org/geeklog/links.php?category=Projects
> > "Handhelds.org Hosted Projects"
> >
> >
> > It was Chris Larwson that started Opie and Jason Perlow who thought up
> > of the name, and who probably actually owns the name, unless he has
> > given you specific rights to it.
> >
> > How can you claim to own the names to these projects?
> >
> > and checking the status on your trademark, it is not yet actually
> > registered, only filed, as of March 6, 2007, and not yet assigned to an
> > examining attorney.
> >
> > > Best Regards,
> > >
> > >
> > > --George
> > >
> > > On Sunday 13 May 2007 05:09 pm, Lorn Potter wrote:
> > >> Hey George,
> > >> Yes, I personally did start an opieII project with te Qtopia 4 source
> > >> code.
> > >>
> > >> It was my understanding that handhelds.org was merely a host for
> > >> projects - like sourceforge.
> > >>
> > >> George France wrote:
> > >>  > Hi Lorn,
> > >>  >
> > >>  > That is not very accurate.  There is nothing new going on. Opie has
> > >>
> > >> always been a trademark of handhelds.org, please see:
> > >>  >     http://www.handhelds.org/legal
> > >>  >
> > >>  > It is now a "registered" trademark, as part of some legal house
> > >>
> > >> cleaning.  A formal trademark usage policy for trademarks should be
> > >> posted on http://www.handhelds.org, near the 1st of the month after
> > >> the legal folks have finished their review.  I expect it to be very
> > >> similar to the ubuntu policy.
> > >>
> > >> except ubuntu is a distribution not a site that hosts open source
> > >> projects.
> > >>
> > >>  > ..and no it is not "all" the projects, as you are implying...
> > >>  >
> > >>  > I would however appreciate that you disclose any conflict of
> > >>  > interest
> > >>
> > >> when posting such messages.  I believe you attempted to started an
> > >> "opieII" project at another site?
> > >>
> > >> There is no conflict of interest, I am still a member of Opie at
> > >> handhelds.org.
> > >>
> > >>  > Sincerely,
> > >>  >
> > >>  >
> > >>  > --George France
> > >>  > CEO, Handhelds.org, Inc.
> > >>  > One of the founders of handhelds.org, 1999.
> > >>  >
> > >>  > On Sunday 13 May 2007 03:10 am, Lorn Potter wrote:
> > >>  >> Just a heads up to all.
> > >>  >> George France has taken it upon himself to trademark the names of
> > >>  >> projects hosted by handhelds.org.
> > >>  >>
> > >>  >> This was filed March 6, 2007.
> > >>  >>
> > >>  >> Serial Number      77123610
> > >>  >>
> > >>  >>
> > >>  >> _______________________________________________
> > >>  >> Open Source User Interface and Apps built on Qt Embedded
> > >>  >> Opie mailing list
> > >>  >> [email protected]
> > >>  >> https://handhelds.org/mailman/listinfo/opie
>
> _______________________________________________
> Open Source User Interface and Apps built on Qt Embedded
> Opie mailing list
> [email protected]
> https://handhelds.org/mailman/listinfo/opie

-- 
Lorn 'ljp' Potter
Software Engineer, Systems Group, MES, Trolltech

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