Re: opie trademark

On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 06:40:31AM +1000, Lorn Potter wrote:
> On Thursday 31 May 2007 06:17, Erik Hovland wrote:
> > On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 05:17:42AM +1000, Lorn Potter wrote:
> 
> >
> > No, he doesn't speak for the community. Neither do you. 
> 
> Sure I do. I have been around in the opie project longer than most. That gives 
> me a right to speak on behalf of the opie community.

By your requirements then George France has the same right to speak on
behalf of hh.org. He has been around hh.org longer then most. If the
Opie community is part of the hh.org community, he can speak for it. If
the Opie community disagrees. It is high time they stood up and said
something.

> > And his name 
> > only appears on the application because someone has to be named.
> > Unfortunately the USPTO process for trademarking requires that an
> > individual and not a corporation be listed in the application. Which
> > means it looks like George is doing it. But if the trademark application
> > is granted handhelds.org will own the trademark.
> 
> handhelds.org did not have rights nor permission to try and trademark the 
> project name.

You continue to assert that the Opie community and hh.org community are
separate. I disagree.

> > > He didn't even ask or even mention that he was trying to do this first!
> >
> > No, handhelds.org didn't ask the Opie community what they wanted to
> > protect. And this is unfortunate. In seeing how badly the GPE situation
> > escalated, I can see why handhelds.org is trying to protect as much of
> > the community as quickly as possible.
> >
> > But not organizing more of the community is a problem with this. Of
> > course it is the same problem you have with trying to use the Opie name.
> > You do not have permission from the community.
> 
> yes, I think I do. At least I asked, in case you missed it.
> http://www.handhelds.org/hypermail/opie-devel/31/3157.html

And you were given permission publicly by one person:
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.opie.devel/3885

While you received an objection from at least two people:
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.opie.devel/3897
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.opie.devel/3898

Is that permission?

> > > > > A big slap in the face, especially after 5 years of being with this
> > > > > project and _then_ being told that the hosting web site is trying to
> > > > > trademark you own work.
> > > >
> > > > I can see how it is hard to accept that something you worked on for
> > > > several years is not yours to do with as you please. But you are not
> > > > the only author nor the only "current" developer.
> > >
> > > No, its not difficult to accept at all, that is part of community
> > > development.
> >
> > OK, then why use the name w/out permission from the community?
> 
> I didn't. I asked first.

And you were given permission?

> > > But, it is not George France and handhelds.org's property either, and
> > > they also cannot do with as they please - such as trying to trademark our
> > > project name out from underneath us and without asking or even consulting
> > > with the dev teams!
> >
> > You keep saying us. handhelds.org is a community. It is trying to
> > protect the trademark of one of its sub communities. What is the Opie
> > community and do they actually think this is a good idea or not? I for
> > one want a clearer boundary between the Opie community and anyone else.
> > Which means, if Opie is part of the handhelds.org community and there
> > are people in another community who are actively hostile to people in
> > the handhelds.org community, Opie should not be associated with that
> > community. But on top of that we as the Opie community are required to
> > do our own enforcement if we assert the tradename as ours.
> >
> > > How can you not see that this is the problem?!
> >
> > I can definitely see the community not wanting its tradenames and
> 
> handhelds.org is not run by the community. it is run by George France. He is 
> not part of the o[p]ie community. 

George is the CEO and the official admin. But he is not handhelds.org.
There is a community there.

E

-- 
Erik Hovland
mail: [email protected]
web: http://hovland.org/
PGP/GPG public key available on request

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