Re: Re: Shadow on Tablets
skeezix <[email protected]> Tue, 2 Apr 2013 22:31:06 -0400 (EDT)
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.handhelds.palm.shadow |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
--Iud3hPdZcWzur2khzX1x4yrvnvifQesL-7eyICp
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
On Mon, 1 Apr 2013, Neil Slater wrote:
# I said at one point that I would follow Shadow into whatever platform
# you chose to support. Unfortunately, technology didn't let me wait, so I
# am in the iOS world, since my wife and I are Mac addicts since 1986. My
# older sons have Androids, though, which may be a better platform (I
# DON'T like Apple's insistence on remote connectivity).
There's positives and negatives to all platforms; its good for the
consumer that such nice alternatives exist.. they're all swooshy with high
res screens; who'd have thought 10 years ago that PDAs of the near future
would be quad core? :)
But yes, I'm not at all a fan of Apple's policies or app-store
designs that squish out the little guys, so on and so forth; at least
they've so far maxe dout at a 30% cut, and dev tools are cheap-ish
(assuming you want to get a Mac or Hackintosh.) (Remember the PalmGear
days where it started at what.. 10-15% cut, and every few months/year
another 5% woudl get chipped away until near the end they were hitting for
60%? Sprint was taking what, 95%?) Apple annoys me with sub arbitrary evil
decisions such as screwing all the iPad1 folks so the firmware updates
nolonger apply, within what.. 18mo of releasing the device? For shame...
The old Mac I used for Shadow Mac builds still works fine (my kids play
with it :) -- but its been good for doing iOS builds for some experiments
I've done. But recently Apple dropped support for that age of machine as
well, so that it can't be used to make iOS apps. Funny that theres
actually nothing about it that makes it unable to perform this function,
other than Apple wanting me to pay the Apple-tax :)
Anyway, best lets not get into that; I'm a grumpy old man now :O
# You say you might work on a minimal replacement if we can get you
# excited. Jeff, we are sitting here, still excited ourselves about a
# piece of software that hasn't been updated in ten(?) years (couldn't
# find a date in the About screen), and that is still loved, still in use
# by some, and missed by most users. I'm sure your grandfather is proud of
# you, Jeff.
I'm quite proud of it all; I should've really made a mint but
honour prevented that... but it was quite an experience to build up a
suite of applications, a number of games, a contracting business for
mobiles etc and take on the big guys... and still keep it friendly, good
prices, etc. We had quite a community, helping each other out and so on.
We pioneered quite a few things together.
I'm friends with some of the other Outliner Guys from them;
they're still sore from the lashing ;)
Good memory you have.
# If you can offer a simple, swooshy-free version of Shadow, I'm sure that
# we, your loyal fans, will create as much word-of-mouth advertising as we
# can; a free or cheap app would let you test the tablet waters and decide
# whether it's worth dancing with sharks to create the Big Version.
Well, as I say.. a mini application ("Miniplan" is the name I've
been tossing around my head for a year) that is really bare bones and
dumb, but does the job, is not too hard an endeaver; always harder than it
should be, but not too bad. The tech I've been leveraging lets it be
developed on desktop, and runs out of the box on Windows and Linux (and
OSX, though a bit more pain there due to many of the recent 'rules'.) I've
also built self-updating tools so my apps can pull down changes from a
server, and built a hosting infrastructure test that can host peoples
documents on my (or licensed others, or home..) servers. Just no front-end
yet ;) (these bits of code are used for many projects, at least. To test
the server hosting portion, I'm running a arcade game competition for 80s
classic arcade games, with head to head scoring and such on the server ;)
# have the undying thanks of the author; send $5 and have the undying
# thanks of the author's wife and children; send $10 and get a thank-you
# note {featuring a drawing from one of the author's children???}; $25
Clever ;)
I'm not sure a KS would be appropriate here; since I'm not one to
take $$ and run off to Cuba, it rather implies that if I got $30k or
something I'd have to drop everythign for 6mo and get it done; at this
stage, when not trying to heavy compete with the existing guys, its better
to play it easy and along the fringe .. not force myself into a 'base
race' situation.
I've got a half dozen projects jugglign right now, but this one is
on my radar again. I shoudl just spend a week and make a really crappy
application, for you to run on a desktop, just to see where I've been
going with the thought process. (if you recall it, think .. same as the
original Palm Shadow release.. nearly same thing. Very limited, very
sucky, but foundation like concrete.) Again, thats a very 'bad way' to
start a modern app ... going with thoughts from a decade past, but what
the heck.. basing it on modern tech, and making it more dynamic
infrastructure, and not being hamstrung with Palm limitations (16mhz
indeed!) sure makes it easier..
jeff
--
If everyone would put barbecue sauce on their food, there would be no war.
--Iud3hPdZcWzur2khzX1x4yrvnvifQesL-7eyICp
Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<html>
<head>
</head>
<body style="background-color: #fff;">
<span style="display:none"> </span>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStartT|**|-~-->
<div id="ygrp-mlmsg" style="position:relative;">
<div id="ygrp-msg" style="z-index: 1;">
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEndT|**|-~-->
<div id="ygrp-text" >
<p>On Mon, 1 Apr 2013, Neil Slater wrote:<br>
<br>
# I said at one point that I would follow Shadow into whatever platform <br>
# you chose to support. Unfortunately, technology didn't let me wait, so I <br>
# am in the iOS world, since my wife and I are Mac addicts since 1986. My <br>
# older sons have Androids, though, which may be a better platform (I <br>
# DON'T like Apple's insistence on remote connectivity).<br>
<br>
There's positives and negatives to all platforms; its good for the <br>
consumer that such nice alternatives exist.. they're all swooshy with high <br>
res screens; who'd have thought 10 years ago that PDAs of the near future <br>
would be quad core? :) <br>
<br>
But yes, I'm not at all a fan of Apple's policies or app-store <br>
designs that squish out the little guys, so on and so forth; at least <br>
they've so far maxe dout at a 30% cut, and dev tools are cheap-ish <br>
(assuming you want to get a Mac or Hackintosh.) (Remember the PalmGear <br>
days where it started at what.. 10-15% cut, and every few months/year <br>
another 5% woudl get chipped away until near the end they were hitting for <br>
60%? Sprint was taking what, 95%?) Apple annoys me with sub arbitrary evil <br>
decisions such as screwing all the iPad1 folks so the firmware updates <br>
nolonger apply, within what.. 18mo of releasing the device? For shame... <br>
The old Mac I used for Shadow Mac builds still works fine (my kids play <br>
with it :) -- but its been good for doing iOS builds for some experiments <br>
I've done. But recently Apple dropped support for that age of machine as <br>
well, so that it can't be used to make iOS apps. Funny that theres <br>
actually nothing about it that makes it unable to perform this function, <br>
other than Apple wanting me to pay the Apple-tax :)<br>
<br>
Anyway, best lets not get into that; I'm a grumpy old man now :O<br>
<br>
# You say you might work on a minimal replacement if we can get you <br>
# excited. Jeff, we are sitting here, still excited ourselves about a <br>
# piece of software that hasn't been updated in ten(?) years (couldn't <br>
# find a date in the About screen), and that is still loved, still in use <br>
# by some, and missed by most users. I'm sure your grandfather is proud of <br>
# you, Jeff.<br>
<br>
I'm quite proud of it all; I should've really made a mint but <br>
honour prevented that... but it was quite an experience to build up a <br>
suite of applications, a number of games, a contracting business for <br>
mobiles etc and take on the big guys... and still keep it friendly, good <br>
prices, etc. We had quite a community, helping each other out and so on. <br>
We pioneered quite a few things together.<br>
<br>
I'm friends with some of the other Outliner Guys from them; <br>
they're still sore from the lashing ;)<br>
<br>
Good memory you have.<br>
<br>
# If you can offer a simple, swooshy-free version of Shadow, I'm sure that <br>
# we, your loyal fans, will create as much word-of-mouth advertising as we <br>
# can; a free or cheap app would let you test the tablet waters and decide <br>
# whether it's worth dancing with sharks to create the Big Version.<br>
<br>
Well, as I say.. a mini application ("Miniplan" is the name I've <br>
been tossing around my head for a year) that is really bare bones and <br>
dumb, but does the job, is not too hard an endeaver; always harder than it <br>
should be, but not too bad. The tech I've been leveraging lets it be <br>
developed on desktop, and runs out of the box on Windows and Linux (and <br>
OSX, though a bit more pain there due to many of the recent 'rules'.) I've <br>
also built self-updating tools so my apps can pull down changes from a <br>
server, and built a hosting infrastructure test that can host peoples <br>
documents on my (or licensed others, or home..) servers. Just no front-end <br>
yet ;) (these bits of code are used for many projects, at least. To test <br>
the server hosting portion, I'm running a arcade game competition for 80s <br>
classic arcade games, with head to head scoring and such on the server ;)<br>
<br>
# have the undying thanks of the author; send $5 and have the undying <br>
# thanks of the author's wife and children; send $10 and get a thank-you <br>
# note {featuring a drawing from one of the author's children???}; $25 <br>
<br>
Clever ;)<br>
<br>
I'm not sure a KS would be appropriate here; since I'm not one to <br>
take $$ and run off to Cuba, it rather implies that if I got $30k or <br>
something I'd have to drop everythign for 6mo and get it done; at this <br>
stage, when not trying to heavy compete with the existing guys, its better <br>
to play it easy and along the fringe .. not force myself into a 'base <br>
race' situation.<br>
<br>
I've got a half dozen projects jugglign right now, but this one is <br>
on my radar again. I shoudl just spend a week and make a really crappy <br>
application, for you to run on a desktop, just to see where I've been <br>
going with the thought process. (if you recall it, think .. same as the <br>
original Palm Shadow release.. nearly same thing. Very limited, very <br>
sucky, but foundation like concrete.) Again, thats a very 'bad way' to <br>
start a modern app ... going with thoughts from a decade past, but what <br>
the heck.. basing it on modern tech, and making it more dynamic <br>
infrastructure, and not being hamstrung with Palm limitations (16mhz <br>
indeed!) sure makes it easier..<br>
<br>
jeff<br>
<br>
--<br>
If everyone would put barbecue sauce on their food, there would be no war.<br>
</p>
</div>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~-->
<div style="color: #fff; height: 0;">__._,_.___</div>
<table cellspacing=4px style="margin-top: 20px; margin-bottom: 10px;">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; font-weight: bold; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA " >
<a style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD" href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxZjdrOXJxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2NDQ5MDIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE2MDYxBG1zZ0lkAzI1MzUzBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTM2NDk1NjMxNw--?act=reply&messageNum=25353">Reply via web post</a>
</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; " >
<a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Re%3A%20%5Bshadow-discuss%5D%20Re%3A%20Shadow%20on%20Tablets" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;">
Reply to sender </a>
</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; ">
<a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Re%3A%20%5Bshadow-discuss%5D%20Re%3A%20Shadow%20on%20Tablets" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD">
Reply to group </a>
</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; " >
<a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJlb3M2ZThvBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2NDQ5MDIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE2MDYxBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM2NDk1NjMxNw--" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD">Start a New Topic</a>
</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #2D50FD; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; " >
<a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss/message/25352;_ylc=X3oDMTM2MTFzODE3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2NDQ5MDIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE2MDYxBG1zZ0lkAzI1MzUzBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM2NDk1NjMxNwR0cGNJZAMyNTM1Mg--" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;">Messages in this topic</a>
(2)
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<!------- Start Nav Bar ------>
<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->
<div id="ygrp-vital" style="background-color: #f2f2f2; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 10px;">
<span id="vithd" style="font-weight: bold; color: #333; text-transform: uppercase; ">Recent Activity:</span>
<ul style="list-style-type: none; margin: 0; padding: 0; display: inline;">
</ul>
<div style="clear: both; padding-top: 2px; color: #1e66ae;">
<a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss;_ylc=X3oDMTJldnM2aGF1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2NDQ5MDIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE2MDYxBHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTM2NDk1NjMxNw--" style="text-decoration: none;">Visit Your Group</a>
</div>
</div>
<div id="ft" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 11px; margin-top: 5px; padding: 0 2px 0 0; clear: both;">
<a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkbDhkZTdoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2NDQ5MDIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE2MDYxBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMzY0OTU2MzE3" style="float: left;"><img src="http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/yg/logo/us.gif" height="15" width="137" alt="Yahoo! Groups" style="border: 0;"/></a>
<div style="color: #747575; float: right;">Switch to: <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Change Delivery Format: Traditional" style="text-decoration: none;">Text-Only</a>, <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Email Delivery: Digest" class="margin-rt" style="text-decoration: none;">Daily Digest</a> • <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Unsubscribe" style="text-decoration: none;">Unsubscribe</a> • <a href="http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/" style="text-decoration: none;">Terms of Use</a> • <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Feedback on the redesigned individual mail v1" style="text-decoration: none;">Send us Feedback </a></div>
</div>
<!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| -->
</div> <!-- ygrp-msg -->
<!-- Sponsor -->
<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->
<div id="ygrp-sponsor" style="width:160px; float:right; clear:none; margin:0 0 25px 0; background: #fff;">
<!-- Start Recommendations -->
<div id="ygrp-reco">
</div>
<!-- End Recommendations -->
</div> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| -->
<div style="clear:both; color: #FFF; font-size:1px;">.</div>
</div>
<img src="http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=2644902/grpspId=1705016061/msgId=25353/stime=1364956317" width="1" height="1"> <br>
<div style="color: #fff; height: 0;">__,_._,___</div>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~-->
</body>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~-->
<head>
<style type="text/css">
<!--
#ygrp-mkp {
border: 1px solid #d8d8d8;
font-family: Arial;
margin: 10px 0;
padding: 0 10px;
}
#ygrp-mkp hr {
border: 1px solid #d8d8d8;
}
#ygrp-mkp #hd {
color: #628c2a;
font-size: 85%;
font-weight: 700;
line-height: 122%;
margin: 10px 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp #ads {
margin-bottom: 10px;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad {
padding: 0 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad p {
margin: 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad a {
color: #0000ff;
text-decoration: none;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc {
font-family: Arial;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd {
margin: 10px 0px;
font-weight: 700;
font-size: 78%;
line-height: 122%;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad {
margin-bottom: 10px;
padding: 0 0;
}
#actions {
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 11px;
padding: 10px 0;
}
#activity {
background-color: #e0ecee;
float: left;
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
padding: 10px;
}
#activity span {
font-weight: 700;
}
#activity span:first-child {
text-transform: uppercase;
}
#activity span a {
color: #5085b6;
text-decoration: none;
}
#activity span span {
color: #ff7900;
}
#activity span .underline {
text-decoration: underline;
}
.attach {
clear: both;
display: table;
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 12px;
padding: 10px 0;
width: 400px;
}
.attach div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
.attach img {
border: none;
padding-right: 5px;
}
.attach label {
display: block;
margin-bottom: 5px;
}
.attach label a {
text-decoration: none;
}
blockquote {
margin: 0 0 0 4px;
}
.bold {
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 13px;
font-weight: 700;
}
.bold a {
text-decoration: none;
}
dd.last p a {
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span {
margin-right: 10px;
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span.yshortcuts {
margin-right: 0;
}
div.attach-table div div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.attach-table {
width: 400px;
}
div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.file-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts {
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
font-weight: normal;
}
.green {
color: #628c2a;
}
.MsoNormal {
margin: 0 0 0 0;
}
o {
font-size: 0;
}
#photos div {
float: left;
width: 72px;
}
#photos div div {
border: 1px solid #666666;
height: 62px;
overflow: hidden;
width: 62px;
}
#photos div label {
color: #666666;
font-size: 10px;
overflow: hidden;
text-align: center;
white-space: nowrap;
width: 64px;
}
#reco-category {
font-size: 77%;
}
#reco-desc {
font-size: 77%;
}
.replbq {
margin: 4px;
}
#ygrp-actbar div a:first-child {
/* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/
margin-right: 2px;
padding-right: 5px;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg {
font-size: 13px;
font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif;
*font-size: small;
*font: x-small;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg table {
font-size: inherit;
font: 100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {
font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {
font:115% monospace;
*font-size:100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg * {
line-height: 1.22em;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg #logo {
padding-bottom: 10px;
}
#ygrp-msg p a {
font-family: Verdana;
}
#ygrp-msg p#attach-count span {
color: #1E66AE;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco #reco-head {
color: #ff7900;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco {
margin-bottom: 20px;
padding: 0px;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li a {
font-size: 130%;
text-decoration: none;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li {
font-size: 77%;
list-style-type: square;
padding: 6px 0;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov ul {
margin: 0;
padding: 0 0 0 8px;
}
#ygrp-text {
font-family: Georgia;
}
#ygrp-text p {
margin: 0 0 1em 0;
}
#ygrp-text tt {
font-size: 120%;
}
#ygrp-vital ul li:last-child {
border-right: none !important;
}
-->
</style>
</head>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~-->
</html>
<!-- end group email -->
--Iud3hPdZcWzur2khzX1x4yrvnvifQesL-7eyICp--