RE: CANOpen CiA 418,419 Battery/Charger questions

Heinz-Jürgen,

I've got the system working well now.  DeltaQ has promised to update the firmware of their charger to let me use PDOs to set the charge voltage and current.   Should happen in January.  Meanwhile I am using SDO messages to set the appropriate OD locations and a PDO to tell the charger that the Battery is ready. 

I now get a seamless transition from the poor quality ELCON J1939 controlled charger to the lower current but far better DeltaQ.  The ELCON can supply 80A but from 27A down to 1A I have a stable DeltaQ output voltage where the ELCON would vary from 26V to 31V with a 28.6V set-point.

Most of my firmware has already been updated to prepare for 3 DeltaQ's in parallel and as the current drops I'll reduce the number of active chargers.

Thanks for all the help.

John Dammeyer



> -----Original Message-----
> From: Heinz-Jürgen Oertel [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: December-09-13 10:14 AM
> To: John Dammeyer
> Cc: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [CANLIST] CANOpen CiA 418,419 Battery/Charger questions
> 
> Am Montag, 9. Dezember 2013, 09:49:04 schrieb John Dammeyer:
> > Heikki,
> >
> > Section 9.1 of which document?  My CiA418 Battery Module document only
> goes up to Section 7.  Same with the Charger CiA419.  I'd better study Dynamic
> SDO requests in order see if that's where the confusion in the specification lies.
> >
> > Since the system I'm working on may have 3 chargers I'm perfectly content
> with a remote control mode of the chargers where they are stupid and send
> absolutely nothing until they have been configured.  I'm happy to configure
> these before installation since their node ID is done in firmware and not with
> switches.  So the PDOs can also be predefined.
> >
> > I just object to multiple nodes sending out SDO read requests when they are
> not the system master.
> 
> 
> John,
> 
> we did something similar in the past for a customer. 418/419 was not available
> at this time.
> We solved the need to
> 
> > support multiple chargers for one battery where the chargers are
> > capable of working in parallel to provide more current than is
> > possible with a single charger.
> 
> by adding manufacturer specific objects and behavior to the chargers.
> The battery did distribute there current needed and the chargers did agree on
> the amount of current in percent to deliver.
> If all chargers can deliver the same amount of max current, they could agree to
> deliver each one 33% of the current
> required by the battery.
> 
> please clarify. Each charger is a separate CANopen node, isn't it?
> 
> I can ask our EnergyBus experts at emtas if the 454 standard has a mechanism
> for it. At least the standard knows of more than one battery and more than one
> charger.
> 
>  Heinz
> 
> >
> > John
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [email protected] [mailto:canlist-
> > > [email protected]] On Behalf Of heikki saha
> > > Sent: December-09-13 1:58 AM
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Subject: Re: [CANLIST] CANOpen CiA 418,419 Battery/Charger questions
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Section 9.1 clearly defines that CANopen multiple device concept may
> > > be used for multiple battery instances. I can't imagine any other approach.
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > >
> > > -H
> > >
> > >
> > > TK Engineering Oy
> > > Heikki Saha, CTO
> > >   M.Sc. Automation
> > >   Dr.Tech. Electronics
> > > Mail address:  P.O. box 810, FIN-65101 VAASA Visit address: Yritt j
> > > nkatu 15,
> > > FIN-65380 VAASA
> > > +358 (0)50 588 6894
> > > [email protected]
> > > http://www.tke.fi/
> > > http://www.canopen.fi/
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "bertil b ck" <[email protected]>
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Cc: "John Dammeyer" <[email protected]>, "heikki saha"
> > > <[email protected]>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2013 9:46:56 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [CANLIST] CANOpen CiA 418,419 Battery/Charger questions
> > >
> > > Hi John,
> > > I had a quick read in CiA 418 and CiA 419.
> > >
> > > My conclusion is also that the specification only is intedned for
> > > one Battery and one Charger.
> > >
> > > Heikki, any comments?
> > >
> > > Br,
> > > Bertil
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "John Dammeyer" <[email protected]>
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Sent: Monday, December 2, 2013 11:58:35 PM
> > > Subject: [CANLIST] CANOpen CiA 418,419 Battery/Charger questions
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I have a question about CANOpen based chargers and Batteries based
> > > on the CiA 418,419 specification.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The 419 document states the Charger shall scan the network for a
> > > Battery Module (418) and read object 1000 from Battery to determine
> > > which PDOs are functional. It will then read the Battery OD PDO
> > > locations to determine what PDO COB-IDs to use.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The standard doesn t appear to support multiple chargers for one
> > > battery where the chargers are capable of working in parallel to
> > > provide more current than is possible with a single charger.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Have I got that right or have I misread the spec?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > >
> > > John Dammeyer
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "ELS! The Solution"
> > >
> > > Automation Artisans Inc.
> > >
> > > http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/
> > >
> > > Ph. 1 250 544 4950
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> 
> --
> mit freundlichen Grüßen
>        Heinz-Jürgen Oertel

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