Re: [PIC] Architecture Migration - was Re: [PIC] PicKitPlus software

Yes, multiple datasheets for ARM, experienced that with application
processors as well as peripheral controllers for novel laptops.

Underlying cause is that the silicon is a mash-up of IP, all conjoined
over the AHB, AXI or other bus.

PIC and AVR arise from single IP source, hence often a single
datasheet.

On the other hand, it was irritating that PIC datasheets tended to
duplicate so much from one model to the other, especially in the
instruction set.  I often wished for a comparison; what has changed in
that section.

On Sun, Jun 22, 2025 at 11:15:53PM -0400, Sean Breheny wrote:
> My understanding is that the original 16C5x architecture did come from GI
> and that all the other developments were after the spin-off of Microchip
> Technology.
> 
> Nowadays, most of my microcontroller projects are test fixtures of one kind
> or another - some to run experiments, some to test boards for work. I
> almost always use the convenient little Teensy boards from PJRC which
> incorporate ARM processors from NXP. Far more powerful than any of the PICs
> I worked with, even dsPIC. I do find it frustrating, though, to find
> answers in the documentation. The full set of documentation is about 2000
> pages spread across 2 or 3 PDFs and then if you want all the details of the
> core itself, that's a whole separate book. I use a version of GCC to write
> C code for them but the open source libraries often do not provide access
> to all the features of the chip (for example, the ADC control functions
> expose only about 2 or 3 out of 6 or 7 triggering modes), so I often have
> to go digging in the actual chip docs. Given the complexity of the chips,
> voluminous docs are inevitable, but I think they could do a better job of
> organizing them. Vital information for even a relatively simple task is
> spread across various sections which makes sense from the chip designer's
> point of view but not from the user's point of view. So, for example, if
> you want to use DMA with the ADCs, you have to sift through the full
> multi-hundred-page section on DMA and all of its features to find the
> relatively simple features needed for the ADC (as opposed to complex tasks
> of moving large blocks of memory, involving protected memory spaces, etc.)
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jun 22, 2025 at 6:31 PM Harold Hallikainen <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> 
> > Topic drift here...
> >
> > It seems that many people have moved away from PIC to ARM, STM32 (also
> > ARM), AVR, etc. I retired a few years ago, so processor choice is not
> > critical to me.
> >
> > Did the original PIC architecture come from General Instrument? I seem to
> > recall that. Google is saying "The PIC (Peripheral Interface Controller)
> > microcontroller was originally developed by General Instrument in 1975 as
> > a peripheral for their 16-bit CP1600 microprocessor. The PIC1640, the
> > first standalone PIC, was later renamed Programmable Intelligent Computer.
> > In 1985, General Instrument spun off their chip division, which became
> > Microchip Technology, and the PIC family became a primary product for the
> > new company."
> >
> > Then there is the 16 bit PIC24H and dsPIC. Was this developed in house by
> > Microchip? Then there is the MIPS architecture in the PIC32. But MIPS has
> > now stopped development on the MIPS architecture and has moved to RISC-V.
> > I wonder where that leaves the PIC32.
> >
> > Since I did a lot of PIC32MX development before I retired, I've continued
> > a hobby project using the PIC32MZ ( https://w6iwi.org/rtty/DspTU2/ ).
> >
> > I see that there is now a PIC64 series with multiple RISC-V cores.
> >
> > So... interesting times!
> >
> > Harold
> > https://w6iwi.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, June 19, 2025 10:00 pm, Xiaofan Chen wrote:
> > > You may want to try the free tool first.
> > > https://github.com/jaka-fi/PICkitminus
> > > https://github.com/jaka-fi/pk2cmd
> > >
> > >
> > > I am not touching PIC myself for quite some time but rather I become an
> > > admin for avrdude project (mainly on the testing and support side). Now
> > we
> > > have Microchip SNAP,  PICKit 4, PICkit 5 and PICkit Basic support for AVR
> > > chips in avrdude as well. avrdude 8.1 will soon be released.
> > > https://github.com/avrdudes/avrdude
> > >
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > > Xiaofan
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jun 20, 2025 at 12:05 PM Bob Blick <[email protected]>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >> Anyone here used this software?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://pickitplus.co.uk/Typesetter/index.php/
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> It claims to drive the PicKit 2 programmer and allow it to program
> > >> newer PICs. I haven't used PICs or a PicKit 2 in a decade, but I have
> > >> one, and a friend asked if I could program a PIC16F18324 with a hex file
> > >> he found for a ham radio gadget he wants to build.
> > >>
> > >> The software is about US $31. I explained this to my friend. Anyone
> > >> here use this tool?
> > >>
> > >> Also, I have no interest in using PICs anymore, but it makes me curious
> > >> about software development of them these days. Does anyone do C
> > >> development without Microchip tools?
> > >>
> > >> Thanks, Bob
> > >> --
> > >> http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
> > >> View/change your membership options at
> > >> https://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
> > >>
> > >
> > > --
> > > http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
> > > View/change your membership options at
> > > https://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Not sent from an iPhone.
> > --
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> > View/change your membership options at
> > https://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
> >
> -- 
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