Re: The code example in onSpinWait() Javadoc

That's the thing, I don't see what is more complex or more instructive
about the differently written loop that breaks on observing a 1-bit state
change.

When I hear "time" pronounced in the context of wait, I shudder. Strict
time bound makes no sense in a non real time OS. You can only formulate a
termination condition in terms of happens before. So you can only say "10ms
elapses before I will break out of the wait loop". But you don't need
onSpinWait to know that. In fact, you just can't implement it without a
computation model with arbitrary suspension points.

Alex


On Thu, 14 Nov 2019, 22:22 Francesco Nigro, <[email protected]> wrote:

> Beside being more complex?
> Not much I admit :)
> But IMO awaiting with no algorithmical indication of the duration of the
> wait (like in the javadoc) and awaiting for a finite amount of "time" a
> condition that will be true at some point, is a better example where to
> apply onSpinWait, although is not technically incorrect to use it for
> "blind" spin loop as well.
> Maybe is just a subtle difference, but I won't encourage users to blindly
> spin loop on conditions and just use onSpinWait to save the day.. probably
> I'm worried too much for something very simple and unavoidable; as @roman
> has suggested, probably no example is better then one that is a superclass
> of all the possible best cases.
>
>
> Il gio 14 nov 2019, 22:51 Alex Otenko <[email protected]> ha
> scritto:
>
>> What's the difference between this example and what's in javadocs?
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> On Thu, 14 Nov 2019, 16:29 Francesco Nigro via Concurrency-interest, <
>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Totally right, sorry again (writing by phone is a terrible idea :( ):
>>> yes , poll should  use  "o = this.obj".
>>>
>>> > Can we get rid of "done"?  Since offerOnce() does not allow null,
>>> then having the done flag does not seem to help anything.
>>> Absolutely yes: I've prepared this as a "simplified" (and wrong due to
>>> the hurry, sorry for that) version of what we do on many queues in JCtools,
>>> that's why it contains some unnecessary bits as you've rightly pointed
>>> out.
>>> Code that is spin awaiting on a condition, sure that it will happen at
>>> some point in the future, is something that could help to understand the
>>> rare cases
>>> where using onSpinWait could be beneficial IMO.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Il giorno gio 14 nov 2019 alle ore 17:18 Nathan and Ila Reynolds <
>>> [email protected]> ha scritto:
>>>
>>>> In poll(), should "this.obj = o" be "o = this.obj"?  Without this
>>>> change, it seems poll() could spin forever.
>>>>
>>>> Should "poll" be renamed to "take" since the method could block until a
>>>> value is available?
>>>>
>>>> Can we get rid of "done"?  Since offerOnce() does not allow null, then
>>>> having the done flag does not seem to help anything.
>>>>
>>>> Is the compiler and execution engine in my head misinterpreting and
>>>> mis-executing the code?
>>>>
>>>> Here is the code with my suggested changes.
>>>>    volatile E obj = null;
>>>>
>>>>    public void offerOnce(E o) {
>>>>       Objects.checkNonNull(o);
>>>>       this.obj = o;
>>>>    }
>>>>
>>>>   public boolean isDone() {
>>>>        return obj != null;
>>>>   }
>>>>
>>>>    public E take() {
>>>>       E o;
>>>>
>>>>       while (true) {
>>>>          o = obj;
>>>>
>>>>          if (o != null)
>>>>             return o;
>>>>
>>>>          java.lang.Thread.onSpinWait();
>>>>       }
>>>>    }
>>>>
>>>> -Nathan
>>>>
>>>> On 11/14/2019 8:54 AM, Francesco Nigro wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Sorry I've written on the email text, I forgot an important part, let
>>>> me write it properly:
>>>>
>>>>    volatile E obj = null;
>>>>    volatile boolean done = false;
>>>>
>>>>    public void offerOnce(E o) {
>>>>       Objects.checkNonNull(o);
>>>>       this.done = true;
>>>>       this.obj = o;
>>>>    }
>>>>
>>>>   public boolean isDone() {
>>>>        return done;
>>>>   }
>>>>
>>>>    public E poll() {
>>>>       E o = this.obj;
>>>>       if (o == null && !this.done) {
>>>>          return null;
>>>>       }
>>>>       //o will be !null at some point
>>>>       do {
>>>>          if (o != null)
>>>>             return o;
>>>>          java.lang.Thread.onSpinWait();
>>>>          this.obj = o;
>>>>       } while(true);
>>>>    }
>>>>
>>>> Similarly to the queue API: poll should return null iff !done, but
>>>> offer update first done and then this.obj:
>>>> poll need to read obj, but has to stay consistent to the ordering, so
>>>> at some point, obj will be visible if done == true.
>>>> On JCtools we have some queues with a similar behaviour (producer
>>>> sequence is advanced before writing the actual element in the queue)
>>>> and we need to spin wait the element apprearence to stay consistent
>>>> with the isEmpty behaviour: that's a good use case for onSpinWait (when it
>>>> works :P).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Il giorno gio 14 nov 2019 alle ore 16:43 Andrew Haley <[email protected]>
>>>> ha scritto:
>>>>
>>>>> On 11/14/19 3:31 PM, Francesco Nigro via Concurrency-interest wrote:
>>>>> >     E o = this.obj;
>>>>> >     if (o == null && !done) {
>>>>> >         return null;
>>>>> >      }
>>>>> >      //o will be !null at some point
>>>>> >      do {
>>>>> >          if (o != null)
>>>>> >             return o;
>>>>> >          java.lang.Thread.onSpinWait();
>>>>> >      } while(true);
>>>>> > }
>>>>> >
>>>>> > In case like this is more appropriate, maybe, but much less intuitive
>>>>> > probably.
>>>>>
>>>>> Umm, what? o is a local. This loop spins forever.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Andrew Haley  (he/him)
>>>>> Java Platform Lead Engineer
>>>>> Red Hat UK Ltd. <https://www.redhat.com>
>>>>> https://keybase.io/andrewhaley
>>>>> EAC8 43EB D3EF DB98 CC77 2FAD A5CD 6035 332F A671
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Concurrency-interest mailing list
>>> [email protected]
>>> http://cs.oswego.edu/mailman/listinfo/concurrency-interest
>>>
>>

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