Re: Re: JSwat on NetBeans platform (Nathan Fiedler)

The Jalopy program is similar to JSwat in how it presents its interface --
it has the core functionality that exists as a set of APIs, while the
interfaces are written as separate pieces. JSwat has this now: it has a
console mode, a graphical mode, a jEdit plugin, and a jext plugin.

I started looking at the NetBeans platform because I noticed that it
implements a lot of the functionality that I want in JSwat. I want a
modular design that will encourage outside contributions in the form of
"plugins" to JSwat, such as non-Java language support. Additionally, I
would like to permit closed-source modules to be written for JSwat (not
that I have any in mind).

While I have not used the NetBeans IDE debugger very much, I have the
feeling that JSwat has considerably more to offer. And if the RFEs in
JSwat's bug database are eventually implemented, it will have quite a bit
of value-add over the fairly basic NetBeans IDE debugger. But perhaps
there are those who disagree. Regardless, the point of JSwat is to provide
a stand-alone debugger that is easy to use and requires very little setup.

Something else to bear in mind: the current versions of JSwat will never
go away. The binary and source packages will continue to be available for
as long as SourceForge exists. Perhaps this answers my own question and
therefore jEdit/JSwat users need not be concerned.

Thanks for your comments.

n


Alex Bär made very interesting points when he said:
> Hi Nathan,
>
> in general I think it is a good idea to use the Netbeans platform as the
> basis for future JSwat.
>
> Regarding your thought about JEdit users, however, you are quite right.
> The
> point is: There is already a good debugger for users of the Netbeans
> platform, namely the debugger that comes with the Netbeans IDE. JEdit
> users don't
> have any other opthat I want in JSwat. I want a modular design that will
encourage outside contributions in the form of "plugins" to JSwat, such
as non-Java language support. Additionally, I would like to permit
closed-source modules to be written for JSwat (not that I have any in
mind).

While I have not used the NetBeans IDE debugger very much, I have the
feeling that JSwat has considerably more to offer. And if the RFEs in
JSwat's bug database are eventually implemented, it will have quite a bit
of value-add over the fairly basic NetBeans IDE debugger. But perhaps
there are those who disagree. Regardless, the point of JSwat is to provide
a stand-alone debugger that is easy to use and requires very little setup.

Something else to bear in mind: the current versions of JSwat will never
go away. The binary and source packages will continue to be available for
as long as SourceForge exists. Perhaps this answers my own question and
therefore jEdit/JSwat users need not be concerned.

Thanks for your comments.

n


Alex Bär made very interesting points when he said:
> Hi Nathan,
>
> in general I think it is a good idea to use the Netbeans platform as the
> basis for future JSwat.
>
> Regarding your thought about JEdit users, however, you are quite right.
> The
> point is: There is already a good debugger for users of the Netbeans
> platform, namely the debugger that comes with the Netbeans IDE. JEdit
> users don't
> have any other option than JSwat, currently, as far as I can see (and the
> same
> holds for VIM users and so on). In fact I do use the Netbeans IDE, but
> sometimes I work on older hardware. In those moments I am really happy
> that there's
> JSwat and VIM or JEdit, which are much less demanding than Netbeans
> regarding
> hardware equipment.
>
> But maybe there's an alternative way for you, how you can make use of the
> NB
> platform without causing deep depression with the JEdit folks. Maybe you
> could take a look at Jalopy. This is code formatting program that exists
> in
> various incarnations. It can be used as a standalone program from the
> console or
> with a GUI, and as a plug-in module within Netbeans and Eclipse and (!)
> JEdit, as well.
>
> As it seems they found an architecture that allows them to maintain all
> these different versions without having too much of a trouble. Maybe it's
> worth a
> look:
>
> http://jalopy.sourceforge.net/
>
> If the module mechanism of the Netbeans IDE is an intrinsic part of the
> Netbeans platform (and otherwise I'd be surprised) you might find a
> similar
> solution, to the benefit of all existing and future users of JSwat.
>
> Should this turn out to be too difficult or not possible for some reason,
> then the JEdit people need JSwat more than the Netbeans folks, who already
> have
> a good solution at hand. I use the chance to say thank you for making
> JSwat
> tion than JSwat, currently, as far as I can see (and the
> same
> holds for VIM users and so on). In fact I do use the Netbeans IDE, but
> sometimes I work on older hardware. In those moments I am really happy
> that there's
> JSwat and VIM or JEdit, which are much less demanding than Netbeans
> regarding
> hardware equipment.
>
> But maybe there's an alternative way for you, how you can make use of the
> NB
> platform without causing deep depression with the JEdit folks. Maybe you
> could take a look at Jalopy. This is code formatting program that exists
> in
> various incarnations. It can be used as a standalone program from the
> console or
> with a GUI, and as a plug-in module within Netbeans and Eclipse and (!)
> JEdit, as well.
>
> As it seems they found an architecture that allows them to maintain all
> these different versions without having too much of a trouble. Maybe it's
> worth a
> look:
>
> http://jalopy.sourceforge.net/
>
> If the module mechanism of the Netbeans IDE is an intrinsic part of the
> Netbeans platform (and otherwise I'd be surprised) you might find a
> similar
> solution, to the benefit of all existing and future users of JSwat.
>
> Should this turn out to be too difficult or not possible for some reason,
> then the JEdit people need JSwat more than the Netbeans folks, who already
> have
> a good solution at hand. I use the chance to say thank you for making
> JSwat
> publicly available, and for making it so good.
>
> Best wishes,
>
>     Alex Bär