RE: Main Changes

Hello Philippe,

just to answer your question, here is what we like most with Simpleorm:

- simple (we could understand the code without being dedicated to this
only task)

- metadata: records are NOT Pojos. They know what they are. This is
essential for us when it comes to linking the UI with the records (we
use BarracudaMVC for that, another "great but no so mainstream" tool).
With Hibernate, using an EntityManager to get metadata is not natural
and mixes UI and persistence layers.

- multi-column PK and FK are quite natural in Simpleorm (contrary to
Composite Keys in Hibernate)

- much less xml stuff (well no xml at all :)... And the annotation way
in Hibrnate is not that much better (you cannot acces them after
compilation, unless they are RUNTIME, in which case they are costly).

So we just feel Simpleorm is simple and efficient (for our needs), while
Hibernate felt bloated and unecessarly complicated, while not providing
the functionnality we wanted regarding metadata (admitedly, we could
have implemented it on top of Hibernate, as it is quite agnostic about
what your persited objects look like, but it existed in Simpleorm, so
why not use Simpleorm instead ?)

There are certainly other points, as I'm not an expert in Hibernate,
although I played with it a bit.

Regards,
Franck



Le mercredi 16 juillet 2008 à 19:37 +0200, Philippe Back (High Octane) a
écrit :
> Hi Anthony,
>  
> Thanks for the explanations.
>  
> I think that I may not add lots of value to the main code, but who
> knows.
> But, maybe creating samples and some documentation is compatible with
> my schedule.
>  
> So, I would like to be added to the list of commiters, SimpleORM is
> really an elegant piece of work and deserves more publicity.
>  
> KR
> /Philippe
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________________
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Anthony Berglas
> Sent: mercredi 16 juillet 2008 12:19
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [SimpleORM] Main Changes
> 
> 
> 
> Hello Phillippe,
> 
> Good to here from you. The sources can be accessed at
> 
> svn co http://simpleorm.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/simpleorm/franck
> 
> Will move it to the main trunk soon.
> 
> Franck has done good work. The main changes are
> 
> + Simplification of References. Foreign keys need explicit
> declaration.
> 
> + Removal of SProperties. Now clean OO.
> 
> + Field validator framework and Enums added.
> 
> + Support for joins (needs review).
> 
> + Separation of explicit DataSet layer from the database 
> aspects. (This took a couple of goes to get right.)
> 
> + Many minor improvments. Eg support for 1.5, better handling of 
> limit/offset, removal of SPreparedStatement/SRecordset, Identifier 
> quoting fixed, SL4J support, no SDataSource, etc.
> 
> If you would like to contribute let me know and I can set up an
> account.
> 
> In terms of Hibernate, there are a number of minor improvements such 
> as the non-POJO being able to support automated field level 
> optimistic locking, ability to retrieve partial records, and much 
> cleaner semantics for relations. But the big issue is simplicity and 
> clarity. Three clicks of the mouse gets you from the external API to 
> the JDBC code (well, almost). Whereas Hibernate is a huge black box.
> 
> I am actually most interested in the alternative issue. What 
> *useful* features does Hibernate have that SimpleOrm lacks. Things 
> like subtypes and many to many are just obscuring, IMHO. But things 
> like batch update during flush are useful, and we should add them.
> 
> All ideas and feedback most welcome.
> 
> Anthony
> 
> At 03:16 AM 16/07/2008, Philippe Back \(High Octane\) wrote:
> 
> >Just wanted to tell you that all this is really interesting when it 
> >comes to API design.
> >
> >Where can I get the source ? Is this in a branch or on the main
> trunk ?
> >
> >Also, I was carried away from SimpleORM and had extensive experience 
> >with Hibernate but really do not like it much.
> >
> >Frank, what would be the key differentiator that makes you tick when 
> >it comes to SimpleORM ?
> >
> >TIA
> >/Philippe Back
> 
> Dr Anthony Berglas, [email protected] Mobile: +61 4 4838 8874
> Just because it is possible to push twigs along the ground with ones
> nose
> does not necessarily mean that is the best way to collect firewood.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
>  



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