Re: Jini vs/and OSGi

On a related note, and eluding to my prevoius email earlier on this subject -

we (and by we I mean the Jini comminuty _AND_ the OSGi community)
shouldn't be considering OSGi and Jini as competitors, just because
there's some runtime linking of code done in both by 'Classloader
Magick (tm)'

There are plenty of things that each can bring to the others table,
and, as Dan, rightly says, this is more of a political issue, than a
technical one, and the only way to dispel this FUD is to get your
hands dirty and write something

I honestly hope Newton continues what it is doing and that Felix and
Tuscany have a good look at River.....

--Calum

On 02/04/07, Dan Creswell <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
> > recognized that total transparency for networked services are not
> > feasible, but just like RMI, make it very simple for the programmer to hand=
> > le
> > the distinction. Why shouldn't it be a matter of setting a property in the=
> >
> > OSGi service to have it exposed as a Jini service? And vice versa. Why
> > wouldn't it be totally natural that the Jini services are visible as OSGi
> > services?
> > Sure there are things that can't be done, due to constraint in one platform=
> >  or
> > the other. BUT that is not the point. It is not "What can it give me?",
> > but "what can I give to it?"...
> >
> > > > hmmmm... Is there any will? Or just the will to criticize, feeling proud
> > > > and "they don't get it"??
> > > Niclas it requires a very strong spinal cord these days to feel proud
> > > and to publicly admit you are using Jini, as it was in the past, so I
> > > just don't understand this last remark.
> >
> > Yeah, not speaking of "publicly" as in going into a sales position, but I w=
> > as
> > refering to 'here'. Gregg says; "OSGi can't give me anything" and I have
> > heard Dan, you and others essentially saying that "Here is a list of
> > scenarios where OSGi can't be used, and here is another list of stuff I wou=
> > ld
>
> Hmmm, are you hurling insults?  Could certainly be taken that way - regardless, I feel I need to clear out some apparent misconceptions.
>
> For the record, I may have posted such statements in the past though I have no recollection and a quick google didn't dig anything out either.  Further I would point out that you (Niclas) and I have had off-list discussions on this topic where I have offered to help out and attempt to build some bridges.  Thus I would suggest you are not painting the entire picture at least in respect of me.
>
> I've also been working with the Newton guys in this area and if you look at my other emails you are going to see that I refer to politics being a problem - note I didn't name names nor did I blame one or other side.
>
> At the end of the day, the Jini code is ALv2, if people don't like it, they can change it.  Thus I fail to understand why if so many people want Jini and OSGi to do stuff together they don't just get on and do it - hack something up, show some value.  If there's a will, there's a way......
>
> I'll finish with a couple of thoughts I have from time to time:
>
> (1) Both Jini and OSGi are working around some inherent issues with Java classloading and packaging.  Perhaps fixing those issues would lead to a happier life for both technologies?
>
> (2) How will the whole Java Module System effort interact with Jini and OSGi?
>
> > loose out on if I deploy on OSGi, and here is a list...."
> > "Proud" as in "I have the answers to my questions, and not interested in
> > sharing..."
> >
> > Gregg; I agree that the Eclipse folks are obnoxiously proud. The lower leve=
> > l
> > guys (Equinox) are more humble and always open to discuss technology.
>
>
> Two cents,
>
> Dan.
>
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