Re: Howard Dean: The Wolf in Sheeps Clothes

On Thursday 28 August 2003 22:00, Andreas Pour wrote:
> Sagie Sokolov wrote:
> > On Thursday 28 August 2003 06:23, Andreas Pour wrote:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > > The word "Marshall Plan" comes to mind.  IMVSO (VS = Very Strong)
> > > spending $50 billion on reconstructing Iraq with local companies is
> > > getting us, and Iraq, a lot further than spending $50 billion in the
> > > next year alone on occupation, and whatever other billions we will
> > > spend enriching Bush and Cheney's favorite corporations.
> > >
> > > As far as radical extremism goes, it's just an issue of having the
> > > right constitution requiring separation of church and state (something
> > > which Keyes, who you mention below, is not to interested in).  While
> > > this constitution is being drafted, the US should immediately stop
> > > working on the oil projects, a pipeline to Israel and talk about
> > > "reparations" to Jews who left Iraq for the "promised land", and
> > > instead concentrate on restoring electricity and water, thereby
> > > demonstrating its intent to fix things and leave rather than to occupy
> > > the country, turn it into a military base, and loot the country for the
> > > multi-nationals and Israel.
> >
> > Burying the Mullahs of Iran would be a great help as well,
>
> Agreed.  Radicalism is bad everywhere (and I would focus on Iran more but,
> hey, nobody is exactly going out of their way to pledge allegiance to that
> radicalism!).
>
> > though it probably
> > would happen anyway, when they get the atom bomb in a year or two and the
> > mushrooms will start popping up all over the place, as the next step in
> > the export of the Islamic Revolution.
>
> Do you have any evidence to support this view?  First, that Iran is
> developing nuclear weapons; and second, that they would pre-emptively use
> them.

Not preemptively the Bush-doctrine style, necessarily, but more in line with 
the suicidal way of action in the name of "Islamic causes" all over the 
world, as if there's not enough evidence already - there's  lots of evidence, 
but without a direct linkage to any political entity against which action can 
be taken, just some fantom groups with pompous names. Nice trick, but I'm not 
sure how long it will stay effective.

> I hope it is not the idiotic / racist view of some Israeli minister who has
> claimed Iran is willing to sacrifice itself to annihilate Israel b/c there
> are other Muslims in the world outside Iran.
>
> I'm actually wondering, e.g., what country Iran has attacked, say, since
> the skirmishes with Britain over Afghanistan / etc. in the mid-1850s (hint:
>  it was neutral, but occupied, in both WW I and WW II; and it was Iraq that
> attacked Iran in 1980).
>
> Basically, what evidence do you have for your claim?
>
> Personally I think Israel's pre-occupation with a "Greater Israel" is a
> much greater threat, and this is based on real facts rather than paranoid
> delusions; and perhaps the real problem Israel has with a powerful Iran is
> that the latter would provide a deterrent against Israel's imperialist
> ambitions in the region.
>
> Consider, for example, that since the start of the "truce" with Palestinian
> militants on June 29,
>
>   Israeli soldiers and settlers have killed 17 people (including
>   seven children), wounded 437 (including 88 children), arrested
>   593 people, confiscated 4457 acres of land for Jewish
>   settlements, bulldozed 987 acres of farmland, destroyed 12,462
>   trees, and destroyed or damaged 253 houses.
>
> http://www.palestine-pmc.com/details.asp?cat=4&id=441
>
> Not to mention the recent bulldozing of an entire Palestinian business
> district (in Nazlat 'Isa, i.e., in the West Bank where the Israelis are
> under many UNSC resolutions forbidden from being) to make room for the
> unlawful Apartheid Wall (see e.g.
> http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1851.shtml).
>

 "There are no facts, only interpretations." - Nietzsche, right? ;-)


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