RE: Question about extensible-exceptions (to official extensible-exceptions maintainer - GHC HQ)
Simon Peyton-Jones <[email protected]> Tue, 8 Jan 2013 13:13:11 +0000
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--===============2239487940685504111== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="_005_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_"; type="multipart/alternative" --_005_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_" --_000_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm no lawyer either, but I was involved in writing the sentence "Modified = versions of this Report may also be copied and distributed for any purpose,= provided that the modified version is clearly presented as such, and that = it does not claim to be a definition of the Haskell 98 Language." At the t= ime our focus was on people being able to re-publish the Haskell Report its= elf without concern about infringing Cambridge University Press's copyright= . Our intent was * to allow arbitrary re-use for any purpose * except only that re-published versions should not claim to be the= original Definition of Haskell 98. So, like Simon M, I don't see any problem with your re-use. (But I am no l= awyer.) Simon From: Pavel Zelinsky [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: 07 January 2013 23:27 To: Ian Lynagh Cc: [email protected]; Simon Marlow; Simon Peyton-Jones Subject: Re: Question about extensible-exceptions (to official extensible-e= xceptions maintainer - GHC HQ) Hi Ian, As you suggested, maybe it is possible to consider code from report as a "m= odified report", but it does not solve the problem unless the condition of = Haskell 98 Report (Haskell FFI) license is satisfied: Modified versions of this Report may also be copied and distributed for any= purpose, provided that the modified version is clearly presented as such, = and that it does not claim to be a definition of the Haskell 98 Language. I know, it might sound awkward, but to satisfy this condition of the licens= e you have to make such required statement in the code! That is why the sec= ond question I asked was: > 2) If the derived code was compiled with the following language in the > license: "modified version is clearly presented as such, and that it does > not claim to be a definition of the Haskell 98 Language"? > Same questions about the "Haskell Foreign..." license. Thanks, Pavel Pavel Zelinsky Senior Manager and Group Leader, DemandTec Softlines Science IBM Enterprise Marketing Management ________________________________ Phone: 1-303-800-4562 E-mail: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> [IBM] 1 Franklin Parkway San Mateo, CA 94403 United States [Inactive hide details for Ian Lynagh ---01/07/2013 04:07:47 PM---On Mon, J= an 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -0700, Pavel Zelinsky wrote]Ian Lynagh ---01/07/2= 013 04:07:47 PM---On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -0700, Pavel Zelinsky = wrote: > From: Ian Lynagh <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> To: Pavel Zelinsky/Boulder/IBM@IBMUS, Cc: Simon Marlow <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>, "cvs-ghc@= haskell.org<mailto:[email protected]>" <[email protected]<mailto:cvs-gh= [email protected]>>, Simon Peyton-Jones <[email protected]<mailto:simonpj@m= icrosoft.com>> Date: 01/07/2013 04:07 PM Subject: Re: Question about extensible-exceptions (to official extensible-e= xceptions maintainer - GHC HQ) ________________________________ On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -0700, Pavel Zelinsky wrote: > > Thank you all for your attention to the problem! I appreciate it! > > Let me try to clarify the question I asked. > > First of all, the same question was raised with Haskell_Containers packag= e > and response from Milan Straka has completely resolved the problem, I hop= e > to receive similar response on the Extensible-Exceptions if > possible/applicable. > > Problem is quite simple: > - Extensible-Exceptions (similar to Containers) license claims that code = is > derived from multiple sources including Haskell 98 Report and Haskell FFI > - Full license of Haskell 98 Report and Haskell FFI does not contain any > code license, but speaks only about entire report or modified report > - So this represents a problem for our attorneys, because license of > Extensible-Exceptions in unclear I'm still not a lawyer, but I would imagine that: * The Haskell 98 report licence applies to the whole report, including any code it contains, any APIs it defines, etc * If you take some code or an API from the report, then you have a modified version of the report * You will have the same problem with the base package Thanks Ian -- Ian Lynagh, Haskell Consultant Well-Typed LLP, http://www.well-typed.com/ --_000_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_ Content-Type: text/html; 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mso-level-text:\F0A7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-18.0pt; font-family:Wingdings;} @list l0:level7 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0B7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-18.0pt; font-family:Symbol;} @list l0:level8 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:o; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-18.0pt; font-family:"Courier New";} @list l0:level9 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0A7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-18.0pt; font-family:Wingdings;} ol {margin-bottom:0cm;} ul {margin-bottom:0cm;} --></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" /> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit"> <o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" /> </o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--> </head> <body lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"> <div class=3D"WordSection1"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I’m no lawyer eithe= r, but I was involved in writing the sentence <i>“Modified versions of this Report may also be copied and distribut= ed for any purpose, provided that the modified version is clearly presented= as such, and that it does not claim to be a definition of the Haskell 98 L= anguage.”</i> At the time our focus was on people being able to re-publish the Haskell Report itself without conce= rn about infringing Cambridge University Press’s copyright. Our= intent was<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve= l1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:S= ymbol;color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">·<span style=3D= "font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> &nbs= p; </span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:= "Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">to allow arbitrar= y re-use for any purpose<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve= l1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:S= ymbol;color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">·<span style=3D= "font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> &nbs= p; </span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:= "Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">except only that = re-published versions should not claim to be the original Definition of Has= kell 98.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span><= /p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">So, like Simon M, I don&#= 8217;t see any problem with your re-use. (But I am no lawyer.)<o:p></= o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span><= /p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Simon<o:p></o:p></span></= p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ve= rdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span><= /p> <div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm = 4.0pt"> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm = 0cm 0cm"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo= nt-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span = lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",&qu= ot;sans-serif""> Pavel Zelinsky [mailto:[email protected]] <br> <b>Sent:</b> 07 January 2013 23:27<br> <b>To:</b> Ian Lynagh<br> <b>Cc:</b> [email protected]; Simon Marlow; Simon Peyton-Jones<br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: Question about extensible-exceptions (to official exten= sible-exceptions maintainer - GHC HQ)<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <p><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans= -serif"">Hi Ian,</span><br> <br> <span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-se= rif"">As you suggested, maybe it is possible to consider code from rep= ort as a "modified report", but it does not solve the problem unl= ess the condition of </span><tt><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">Haskell 98 Report (Haskell FFI<= /span></tt><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",&q= uot;sans-serif"">) license is satisfied:</span><o:p></o:p></p> <p><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Modi= fied versions of this Report may also be copied and distributed for any pur= pose, provided that the <u>modified version is clearly presented as such, and that it does not clai= m to<b> be a definition of the Haskell 98 Language</b></u><b>.</b></sp= an> <o:p></o:p></p> <p><br> <span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-se= rif"">I know, it might sound awkward, but to satisfy this condition of= the license you have to make such <u>required </u>statement in the code! That is why the second question I as= ked was:</span><br> <tt><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">> 2) If the derived code was compil= ed with the following language in the</span></tt><span style=3D"font-size:1= 0.0pt;font-family:"Courier New""><br> <tt>> license: "modified version is clearly presented as such, and = that it does</tt><br> <tt>> not claim to be a definition of the Haskell 98 Language"?</tt= ><br> <tt>> Same questions about the "Haskell Foreign..." license.</= tt></span><br> <br> <span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-se= rif"">Thanks,</span><br> <br> <span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-se= rif"">Pavel</span><br> <br> <br> <b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans= -serif";color:#888888">Pavel Zelinsky</span></b><span style=3D"font-si= ze:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><br> Senior Manager and Group Leader, DemandTec Softlines Science<br> IBM Enterprise Marketing Management</span> <o:p></o:p></p> <table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding= =3D"0"> <tbody> <tr> <td width=3D"544" colspan=3D"2" style=3D"width:408.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm = 0cm"> <div class=3D"MsoNormal"> <hr size=3D"2" width=3D"100%" align=3D"left"> </div> </td> </tr> <tr> <td width=3D"334" valign=3D"top" style=3D"width:250.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm= 0cm"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"= Arial","sans-serif";color:#466BB0">Phone:</span></b><span st= yle=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"= ;color:#5F5F5F"> 1-303-800-4562</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:7.5p= t;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#466BB0"><br> E-mail:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial&qu= ot;,"sans-serif";color:#5F5F5F"> </span><a href=3D"mailto:tn= [email protected]" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:= "Arial","sans-serif";color:#5F5F5F">[email protected]= </span></a><o:p></o:p></p> </td> <td width=3D"210" valign=3D"top" style=3D"width:157.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm= 0cm"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"right" style=3D"text-align:right"><img bord= er=3D"0" width=3D"70" height=3D"24" id=3D"_x0000_i1026" src=3D"cid:image001= [email protected]" alt=3D"IBM"><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-fam= ily:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#5F5F5F"><br> <br> 1 Franklin Parkway<br> San Mateo, CA 94403<br> United States</span><o:p></o:p></p> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> <p><br> <br> <img border=3D"0" width=3D"16" height=3D"16" id=3D"_x0000_i1027" src=3D"cid= :[email protected]" alt=3D"Inactive hide details for Ian Lynag= h ---01/07/2013 04:07:47 PM---On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -0700, Pav= el Zelinsky wrote"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial&= quot;,"sans-serif";color:#424282">Ian Lynagh ---01/07/2013 04:07:47 PM---On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -070= 0, Pavel Zelinsky wrote: ></span><br> <br> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if";color:#5F5F5F">From: </span><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","s= ans-serif"">Ian Lynagh <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">ian@w= ell-typed.com</a>></span><br> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if";color:#5F5F5F">To: </span> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if"">Pavel Zelinsky/Boulder/IBM@IBMUS, </span><br> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if";color:#5F5F5F">Cc: </span> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if"">Simon Marlow <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">marlowsd@g= mail.com</a>>, "<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">cvs-ghc@hask= ell.org</a>" <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">cvs-ghc@haskel= l.org</a>>, Simon Peyton-Jones <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">simonpj@mi= crosoft.com</a>></span><br> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if";color:#5F5F5F">Date: </span><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","s= ans-serif"">01/07/2013 04:07 PM</span><br> <span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-ser= if";color:#5F5F5F">Subject: </span><span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","s= ans-serif"">Re: Question about extensible-exceptions (to official exte= nsible-exceptions maintainer - GHC HQ)</span><o:p></o:p></p> <div class=3D"MsoNormal"> <hr size=3D"2" width=3D"100%" noshade=3D"" style=3D"color:#8091A5" align=3D= "left"> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br> <br> <br> <tt><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 03:51:57PM -07= 00, Pavel Zelinsky wrote:</span></tt><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-f= amily:"Courier New""><br> <tt>> </tt><br> <tt>> Thank you all for your attention to the problem! I appreciate it!<= /tt><br> <tt>> </tt><br> <tt>> Let me try to clarify the question I asked.</tt><br> <tt>> </tt><br> <tt>> First of all, the same question was raised with Haskell_Containers= package</tt><br> <tt>> and response from Milan Straka has completely resolved the problem= , I hope</tt><br> <tt>> to receive similar response on the Extensible-Exceptions if</tt><b= r> <tt>> possible/applicable.</tt><br> <tt>> </tt><br> <tt>> Problem is quite simple:</tt><br> <tt>> - Extensible-Exceptions (similar to Containers) license claims tha= t code is</tt><br> <tt>> derived from multiple sources including Haskell 98 Report and Hask= ell FFI</tt><br> <tt>> - Full license of Haskell 98 Report and Haskell FFI does not conta= in any</tt><br> <tt>> code license, but speaks only about entire report or modified repo= rt</tt><br> <tt>> - So this represents a problem for our attorneys, because license = of</tt><br> <tt>> Extensible-Exceptions in unclear</tt><br> <br> <tt>I'm still not a lawyer, but I would imagine that:</tt><br> <tt>* The Haskell 98 report licence applies to the whole report, including<= /tt><br> <tt> any code it contains, any APIs it defines, etc</tt><br> <tt>* If you take some code or an API from the report, then you have a</tt>= <br> <tt> modified version of the report</tt><br> <tt>* You will have the same problem with the base package</tt><br> <br> <br> <tt>Thanks</tt><br> <tt>Ian</tt><br> <tt>-- </tt><br> <tt>Ian Lynagh, Haskell Consultant</tt><br> <tt>Well-Typed LLP, <a href=3D"http://www.well-typed.com/">http://www.well-= typed.com/</a></tt><br> <br> </span><o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> </body> </html> --_000_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_-- --_005_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_ Content-Type: image/jpeg; name="image001.jpg" Content-Description: image001.jpg Content-Disposition: inline; filename="image001.jpg"; size=1333; creation-date="Tue, 08 Jan 2013 13:13:11 GMT"; modification-date="Tue, 08 Jan 2013 13:13:11 GMT" Content-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 /9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQEAYABgAAD/2wBDAAgGBgcGBQgHBwcJCQgKDBQNDAsLDBkSEw8UHRofHh0a HBwgJC4nICIsIxwcKDcpLDAxNDQ0Hyc5PTgyPC4zNDL/2wBDAQkJCQwLDBgNDRgyIRwhMjIyMjIy MjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjL/wAARCAAYAEYDASIA AhEBAxEB/8QAHwAAAQUBAQEBAQEAAAAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtRAAAgEDAwIEAwUFBAQA AAF9AQIDAAQRBRIhMUEGE1FhByJxFDKBkaEII0KxwRVS0fAkM2JyggkKFhcYGRolJicoKSo0NTY3 ODk6Q0RFRkdISUpTVFVWV1hZWmNkZWZnaGlqc3R1dnd4eXqDhIWGh4iJipKTlJWWl5iZmqKjpKWm p6ipqrKztLW2t7i5usLDxMXGx8jJytLT1NXW19jZ2uHi4+Tl5ufo6erx8vP09fb3+Pn6/8QAHwEA AwEBAQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtREAAgECBAQDBAcFBAQAAQJ3AAECAxEEBSEx BhJBUQdhcRMiMoEIFEKRobHBCSMzUvAVYnLRChYkNOEl8RcYGRomJygpKjU2Nzg5OkNERUZHSElK U1RVVldYWVpjZGVmZ2hpanN0dXZ3eHl6goOEhYaHiImKkpOUlZaXmJmaoqOkpaanqKmqsrO0tba3 uLm6wsPExcbHyMnK0tPU1dbX2Nna4uPk5ebn6Onq8vP09fb3+Pn6/9oADAMBAAIRAxEAPwDuNY0e 30y48y+tPDcIndihlE+W55zjvyK0tI0Hz9Gu3t7LQ2ivI1EZh83ZJg/xZ5x9K1/En2z/AEb7J/av 8W7+z/K9sbt/6Y960dJ83+yrfz/tPm7fm+1bfM6/xbeM/SuuVWXs07/ic8aa52cBJo9rFqa6a9p4 ZW8YgCEifJJGRVjy18L6jGZB4esZyA3ymcEr0+h79a2db/tL+1Jfs/8Ab/lYGPsfkeX07b+aqWn9 q/bIPN/4Sfy/MG7zfs23Gf4sc4+lac7lG7enqRypPRfgJ4p0+D7V/adzb6J9nlCIs14Jd5OOh28d qm8GXVklzcWls+kDeok2WPmAkjgk7/qOlbfiH7T9gT7L/aHmeaM/YPL34weu/jH69KxlXVbWG1ug /iGdmLb4G+zkr6bhwPpg1nGXNS5W/wAS2uWpdGR4gudMvNbuHmfw/IyHy83PnGQY7Hbx1z0re8J6 ULUtex22lRwTxDZJZeZlhnvu7VSaLVhZpN5viYyNIymMfZtygDqe2D+ddVpnmf2Zb+d9o8zYN32j b5mf9rbxn6UVZ2pqKf4hTjefMy3RRRXIdB5xrGsW+p3Hl3934bmEDsEEpnyvPOcd+BWlpGveRo12 lve6GsVnGpjEPm7I8n+LPOPpRRXqTox9mvl+ZwRqPnfzMiTWLWXVF1J7vwy14pBWYmfIIGBUstzH 4k1CISyeHLy5ICLgTk4z7UUVc6ShFyW6JjNydn1L/inUIPtP9mXVxon2eII6w3hl3g46/Lx3qdbO zvPBEXlxaRJHG+9MeYYAd2Dj+LvRRXNKPLSg0+qN07zkmN8S2tjY6RpdtcJo8Sx7gq3XmBAcDOzb z+dW/Ceqi6LWUdzpUkEEQ2R2XmZUZ77u1FFHLfDcz/rUOa1blX9aEf8Ab+ri7nEdl9okUgfZFYbk GOpxyOeOevUcUUUVDUV9lFJyfU//2Q== --_005_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_ Content-Type: image/gif; name="image002.gif" Content-Description: image002.gif Content-Disposition: inline; filename="image002.gif"; size=105; creation-date="Tue, 08 Jan 2013 13:13:11 GMT"; modification-date="Tue, 08 Jan 2013 13:13:11 GMT" Content-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R0lGODlhEAAQAKECAMzMzAAAAP///wAAACH5BAEAAAIALAAAAAAQABAAAAIXlI+py+0PopwxUbpu ZRfKZ2zgSJbmSRYAIf4fT3B0aW1pemVkIGJ5IFVsZWFkIFNtYXJ0U2F2ZXIhAAA7 --_005_59543203684B2244980D7E4057D5FBC13F7F3633DB3EX14MBXC312e_-- --===============2239487940685504111== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Cvs-ghc mailing list [email protected] http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/cvs-ghc --===============2239487940685504111==--