Re: Re: Sublicensing seems possible

The subprojects mentioned are new. Schools are starting to think about
all the teacher hours they could pay with their software licensing
budgets. Various user groups are starting to tailor free alternatives
for them to consider. People often check out and maybe even use whatever
tools they have preinstalled on their computers. Do you see where this is 
going?

[what's stopping open source/free software people from contributing to
Squeak]
If they happen to know about Smalltalk, or like reading licenses for
fun, probably nothing. If they compare Python and Squeak, notice that
Squeak isn't DFSG, and isn't OSI (but Python is...), they might just
think "why bother?". And there goes another one...

BTW, have you looked at the DFSG? if you did, you might wish Squeak's
license did fit that definition, because it's really quite nice.
Licenses that are _fair_... gee, imagine that.

Daniel

Gary Fisher <[email protected]> wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniel Vainsencher" <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Squeakfoundation]Re: Sublicensing seems possible
> 
> 
> > And the fact that the world doesn't want to buy iraqi oil doesn't limit
> > the iraqies, it just limits the world, right?
> >
> 
> Um, it would if the Iraqis were offering it for free.  (-:
> 
> > You don't want kids in schools to have Squeak preinstalled on their
> > computers, simply because it is part of DebianJr/DebianEdu/Debian
> > multimedia project (I can never remember their precise name)?
> >
> 
> Daniel, I'd like to see every school running Debian but the fact is most
> aren't; further, I strongly suspect most schools where Squeak is installed
> aren't running Debian either.  My own experience is that a certain decidedly
> un-open OS rules the roost thus far, but Squeak doesn't really seem to care.
> 
> > You don't want the hoards of people that contribute their programming
> > time to free software in stiffer/poorer languages to feel free and safe
> > to contribute Squeak code?
> >
> > I do.
> >
> 
> So do I, nor do I see what's holding them back.
> 
> Gary
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Squeakfoundation mailing list
> [email protected]
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/listinfo/squeakfoundation
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Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:21:47 +0200
From: Daniel Vainsencher <[email protected]>
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<shifting to sqf list>

That's an interesting point. Does that mean we actually delay 3.5, when
the 3.6 update stream has already started? another question is, how did
we get into gamma, when apparently, one of our two goals for the release
isn't actually achieved?

Daniel

Tim Rowledge <[email protected]> wrote:
> Daniel Vainsencher <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > AFAICT, this fix is KCP territory. Unless there is a very good reason
> > otherwise, I would await their recommendation (and not delay the
> > release).
> Well since the 3.5 release was purported to be mostly to include a fix
> for a very similar bug and the bug in question has pretty similar
> effects - cannot recompile a number of classes - I'd say that without a
> fix we really shouldn't even consider 3.5 in beta in any meaningful
> sense.
> 
> tim
> -- 
> Tim Rowledge, [email protected], http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim
> Spellchecker not found.  Press -- to continue ...
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Subject: Should "Weakness weakness" hold up 3.5? (Was: RE:
	[Squeakfoundation]Re: [UPDATES] 3.5gamma)
Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 08:40:15 -0500
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For folks that haven't been following this too closely:

The bug that Andreas's fix addressed was: "adding inst var to =
ClassDescription breaks ClassBuilder" ( =
http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/3058 ).  According to Andreas, this =
bug only happened when one re-compiled Behavior, ClassDescription, or =
Class.  This bug was an obstacle for Nathanael Scharli's Traits project. =
 That bug appears to be fixed.

Tim discovered a separate bug, caused by how ClassBuilder validates the =
matchup between superclass format and subclass format during =
recompilation of a "variable" class with at least one "weak" subclass.  =
I posted a tentative fix.  I am not at all sure how many ways one could =
break that class-format validation logic.  The format validation check =
may well need more logic for matching the various class formats ( the =
original logic was "if newType ~~ oldType then throw error" ).


-----Original Message-----
From:	Daniel Vainsencher [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent:	Thu 4/3/2003 8:21 AM
To:	[email protected]
Cc:	The general-purpose Squeak developers listSubject:	=
[Squeakfoundation]Re: [UPDATES] 3.5gamma
<shifting to sqf list>

That's an interesting point. Does that mean we actually delay 3.5, when
the 3.6 update stream has already started? another question is, how did
we get into gamma, when apparently, one of our two goals for the release
isn't actually achieved?

Daniel

Tim Rowledge <[email protected]> wrote:
> Daniel Vainsencher <[email protected]> wrote:
>=20
> > AFAICT, this fix is KCP territory. Unless there is a very good =
reason
> > otherwise, I would await their recommendation (and not delay the
> > release).
> Well since the 3.5 release was purported to be mostly to include a fix
> for a very similar bug and the bug in question has pretty similar
> effects - cannot recompile a number of classes - I'd say that without =
a
> fix we really shouldn't even consider 3.5 in beta in any meaningful
> sense.
>=20
> tim
> --=20
> Tim Rowledge, [email protected], http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim
> Spellchecker not found.  Press -- to continue ...
_______________________________________________
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Subject: Re: [Squeakfoundation]Re: Sublicensing seems possible
From: Cees de Groot <[email protected]>
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As an extra data point to support the 'pro re/sublicensing faction'
here: Squeak cannot be part of the CD with educational apps that the
SEUL/SchoolForge project is preparing and which is meant to be
distributed in large numbers at teachers' conferences etcetera. The
reason: they won't include non-free software, in fact they only allow a
set of 'known good' licenses in order to be sure that what they
distribute is usable as they intend it.

I haven't mentioned it yet, but I like the Betamax analogy...



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