Re: JNIPort - is there anyone willing to maintain it?
Holger Kleinsorgen <[email protected]> Thu, 25 Sep 2025 13:21:56 +0200
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.lang.smalltalk.vwnc |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <CAGhifExLQ1_Nhvh4mGoPQem=wRQnHR5L_t6as8=hFALcaHyJAA@mail.gmail.com> |
--0000000000003f0ac7063f9e613d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Joachim , if there is no one else interested in maintaining the code, then I can adopt it. The basic plan: - Publish the VW code in Github - Publish the Pharo code in Github (must check if Squeaksource or SmalltalkHub contains the most recent code) - Check if it runs with the most recent version of Pharo (no idea if I would fix it if it doesn't) - Move the documentation to Github We (the company I'm working for) have been using JNIPort for quite a while (up to VW 9.4.1 and Java 17). The VAST port and other ports must be maintained by other folks, though. Holger Am Do., 25. Sept. 2025 um 10:59 Uhr schrieb Joachim Geidel < [email protected]>: > Dear Thomas, > > I definitely do not see the maintenance of JNIPort as enhancing Cincom=E2= =80=99s > products. You wouldn=E2=80=99t consider writing an open source applicatio= n running > on MS Windows or an open source library for developers who are working on > Windows being an =E2=80=9Eenhancement=E2=80=9C of Windows, thus benefitin= g MS, or would you? > > While Cincom was so kind to including it as a contribution in the > VisualWorks distribution, it has also been available for Dolphin Smalltal= k, > Pharo, and VASt in a long time. JNIPort has always been developed > completely independently from any of the companies offering Smalltalk IDE= s. > > JNIPort works on VW 8.3, as far as I know, so there=E2=80=99s no work to = be done > at all for making it work for VWNC users. But even if VWNC is no longer > actively supported by Cincom, there may still be Cincom customers who are > interested in using JNIPort on one of the more recent VisualWorks version= s, > and who could have an interest in adapting it to that version. In such a > case, a JNIPort user=E2=80=99s contribution in the form of an update wou= ld be > uploaded directly to the Cincom public repository. I don=E2=80=99t see ho= w this > would mean =E2=80=9Ea lot of time and effort=E2=80=9C for a potential mai= ntainer of JNIPort > apart from updating some small parts of the JNIPort documentation. > > And then, there=E2=80=99s Pharo, which has an active community, and which= I > suspect to have more active users now than Cincom Smalltalk. Migrating > JNIPort to Pharo 14 with some help from the Pharo community shouldn=E2=80= =99t be a > lot of work. > > I am simply looking for someone willing to keep the strings together and > to prevent that JNIPort accidentally disappears, not someone who invests = a > lot of time and effort in active development. My ideas about the > maintainer=E2=80=99s role: Someone wants to use it, work has to be done t= o make it > work, so they do it themselves and tell the maintainer about it, who then > updates the docs. Google switches off Google Sites - the maintainer moves > the documentation to another place. And that=E2=80=99s more or less it, u= nless the > maintainer wants to have some fun with enhancing JNIPort for some reason, > just as I did when I ported it to VW and Pharo just because I thought tha= t > might be interesting and fun (and it was). > > Joachim > > Am 24.09.2025 um 19:31 schrieb Thomas Sattler <[email protected]>: > > Joachim, > > Cincom has basically abandoned the VWNC distribution. The "latest" > version one can obtain without paying for a license is VW 8.3, which was > released in 2017. > > it's hard to imagine people spending a lot of time and effort enhancing a > system that old, when the vendor isn't committed to it. I'm sure Cincom = is > committed to the paying customers, but why should we help with that? > > --Tom > > > > On Wed, Sep 24, 2025 at 4:36=E2=80=AFAM Joachim Geidel <joachim.geidel@po= steo.de> > wrote: > >> Dear fellow Smalltalkers, >> >> JNIPort is an interface from Smalltalk to the Java VM which was >> originally developed by Chris Uppal for Dolphin Smalltalk. It enables >> Smalltalk applications to use software written in Java seamlessly, local= ly >> and with low overhead, without resorting to network based interfaces lik= e >> e.g. using microservices. Documentation is at >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://sites.google.com/site/jniport/__;!!D= Z3fjg!9JVpDqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi1HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_du= Rg_d-WBWHHLFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbqwGQFahg$ >> . >> >> I have ported JNIPort to VisualWorks and Pharo, and Ben van Dijk, Adriaa= n >> van Os and Rolf van der Vleuten have ported it to VASt ( >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://vastgoodies.com/projects/JNIPort__;!= !DZ3fjg!9JVpDqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi1HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_= duRg_d-WBWHHLFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbql_CqFlw$ >> ). >> >> The last time I really worked on JNIPort was in 2014, if I remember >> correctly. Now that I am retired and haven=E2=80=99t written a single li= ne of >> Smalltalk code in five years, I am wondering if there is anybody willing= to >> take over. >> >> I haven=E2=80=99t had any enquiries about JNIPort since 2020, so the tas= k would >> be easy: >> - Take over ownership of the documentation site. >> - Possibly move the source code for the Pharo version to Gitlab (it is >> still in the ancient SmalltalkHub repository). >> - Optionally integrate any changes from JNIPort users, e.g. when they >> adapt it to more recent versions of VisualWorks or Pharo. There hasn't b= een >> any community input since 2017 (or was it 2019?). >> >> If nobody takes over, then JNIPort will be one of the many abandoned ope= n >> source projects and disappear sooner or later when SmalltalkHub, the Cin= com >> Public Repository and the documentation site are switched off. >> >> On the other hand, I do not know if there is actually anybody using >> JNIPort. If it has no users, there is no harm in its disappearance, and >> maintaining it would be a waste of time. >> >> Cheers >> Joachim Geidel > > > --0000000000003f0ac7063f9e613d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div> Joachim ,</div><div><br></div><div>if there is no one else interested in ma= intaining the code, then I can adopt it. The basic plan:</div><div>- Publis= h the VW code in Github</div><div>- Publish the Pharo code in Github (must = check if Squeaksource or SmalltalkHub contains the most recent code)</div><= div>- Check if it runs with the most recent version of Pharo (no idea if I = would fix it if it doesn't)</div><div> <div>- Move the documentation to Github</div><div><br></div><div>We (the co= mpany I'm working for) have been using JNIPort for quite a while (up to= VW 9.4.1 and Java 17).</div><div>The VAST port and other ports must be mai= ntained by other folks, though.</div><div></div><br></div><div>Holger</div>= </div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><div dir=3D"ltr"= class=3D"gmail_attr">Am Do., 25. Sept. 2025 um 10:59=C2=A0Uhr schrieb Joac= him Geidel <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">joachim.geidel@p= osteo.de</a>>:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi= n:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex= "><div>Dear Thomas,<div><br></div><div>I definitely do not see the maintena= nce of JNIPort as enhancing Cincom=E2=80=99s products. You wouldn=E2=80=99t= consider writing an open source application running on MS Windows or an op= en source library for developers who are working on Windows being an =E2=80= =9Eenhancement=E2=80=9C of Windows, thus benefiting MS, or would you?</div>= <div><br></div><div>While Cincom was so kind to including it as a contribut= ion in the VisualWorks distribution, it has also been available for Dolphin= Smalltalk, Pharo, and VASt in a long time. JNIPort has always been develop= ed completely independently from any of the companies offering Smalltalk ID= Es.</div><div><br></div><div>JNIPort works on VW 8.3, as far as I know, so = there=E2=80=99s no work to be done at all for making it work for VWNC users= . But even if VWNC is no longer actively supported by Cincom, there may sti= ll be Cincom customers who are interested in using JNIPort on one of the mo= re recent VisualWorks versions, and who could have an interest in adapting = it to that version. In such a case, a =C2=A0JNIPort user=E2=80=99s contribu= tion in the form of an update would be uploaded directly to the Cincom publ= ic repository. I don=E2=80=99t see how this would mean =E2=80=9Ea lot of ti= me and effort=E2=80=9C for a potential maintainer of JNIPort apart from upd= ating some small parts of the JNIPort documentation.=C2=A0</div><div><br></= div><div>And then, there=E2=80=99s Pharo, which has an active community, an= d which I suspect to have more active users now than Cincom Smalltalk. Migr= ating JNIPort to Pharo 14 with some help from the Pharo community shouldn= =E2=80=99t be a lot of work.</div><div><br></div><div>I am simply looking f= or someone willing to keep the strings together and to prevent that JNIPort= accidentally disappears, not someone who invests a lot of time and effort = in active development. My ideas about the maintainer=E2=80=99s role: Someon= e wants to use it, work has to be done to make it work, so they do it thems= elves and tell the maintainer about it, who then updates the docs. Google s= witches off Google Sites - the maintainer moves the documentation to anothe= r place. And that=E2=80=99s more or less it, unless the maintainer wants to= have some fun with enhancing JNIPort for some reason, just as I did when I= ported it to VW and Pharo just because I thought that might be interesting= and fun (and it was).</div><div><br></div><div>Joachim</div><div><div><br>= <blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>Am 24.09.2025 um 19:31 schrieb Thomas Sattle= r <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">tomsattler@= gmail.com</a>>:</div><br><div><div dir=3D"ltr">Joachim,<div><br></div><d= iv>Cincom has basically abandoned the VWNC distribution.=C2=A0 The "la= test" version one can obtain without paying for a license is VW 8.3, w= hich was released in 2017.</div><div><br></div><div>it's hard to imagin= e people spending a lot of time and effort enhancing a system that old, whe= n the vendor isn't committed to it.=C2=A0 I'm sure Cincom is commit= ted to the paying customers, but why should we help with=C2=A0that?</div><d= iv><br></div><div>--Tom</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><br><div c= lass=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Sep 24, = 2025 at 4:36=E2=80=AFAM Joachim Geidel <<a href=3D"mailto:joachim.geidel= @posteo.de" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br></= div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;bor= der-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Dear fellow Smalltalk= ers,<br> <br> JNIPort is an interface from Smalltalk to the Java VM which was originally = developed by Chris Uppal for Dolphin Smalltalk. It enables Smalltalk applic= ations to use software written in Java seamlessly, locally and with low ove= rhead, without resorting to network based interfaces like e.g. using micros= ervices. Documentation is at <a href=3D"https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/= /sites.google.com/site/jniport/__;!!DZ3fjg!9JVpDqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi= 1HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_duRg_d-WBWHHLFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbqwGQFahg$= " rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://= sites.google.com/site/jniport/__;!!DZ3fjg!9JVpDqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi1= HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_duRg_d-WBWHHLFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbqwGQFahg$<= /a> .<br> <br> I have ported JNIPort to VisualWorks and Pharo, and Ben van Dijk, Adriaan v= an Os and Rolf van der Vleuten have ported it to VASt (<a href=3D"https://u= rldefense.com/v3/__https://vastgoodies.com/projects/JNIPort__;!!DZ3fjg!9JVp= Dqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi1HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_duRg_d-WBWHH= LFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbql_CqFlw$" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://= urldefense.com/v3/__https://vastgoodies.com/projects/JNIPort__;!!DZ3fjg!9JV= pDqpxcqz6oMahTzP21-BTpfMxRHsi1HUS30Yd6Gm-8j4kRcgBOLmg6z342WonIj_duRg_d-WBWH= HLFGX2ohB5doAnD8eNKbql_CqFlw$</a> ).<br> <br> The last time I really worked on JNIPort was in 2014, if I remember correct= ly. Now that I am retired and haven=E2=80=99t written a single line of Smal= ltalk code in five years, I am wondering if there is anybody willing to tak= e over.<br> <br> I haven=E2=80=99t had any enquiries about JNIPort since 2020, so the task w= ould be easy:<br> - Take over ownership of the documentation site.<br> - Possibly move the source code for the Pharo version to Gitlab (it is stil= l in the ancient SmalltalkHub repository).<br> - Optionally integrate any changes from JNIPort users, e.g. when they adapt= it to more recent versions of VisualWorks or Pharo. There hasn't been = any community input since 2017 (or was it 2019?).<br> <br> If nobody takes over, then JNIPort will be one of the many abandoned open s= ource projects and disappear sooner or later when SmalltalkHub, the Cincom = Public Repository and the documentation site are switched off.<br> <br> On the other hand, I do not know if there is actually anybody using JNIPort= . If it has no users, there is no harm in its disappearance, and maintainin= g it would be a waste of time.<br> <br> Cheers<br> Joachim Geidel</blockquote></div> </div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div> --0000000000003f0ac7063f9e613d--