Re: [amugtalk] Splitting screens

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Dual window support on the mac is painful.

In older version (10.9.5), left/right works just fine. Vertical will =
sort-of work, if the menu bar is on the top window, and the widths of =
the screens match. And this will work *until* you right click. (Or maybe =
it was when a context menu came up -- I never tested in a drawing =
program where right clicking just changed to the other pen.)

The real problem is the "full screen" concept.
In 10.9.5, "full screen" has two different implementations. One is "Make =
this window content cover this entire screen, but do not alter the =
second screen." This is the *good* system. It lets me use my 720p =
monitor to watch a 720p video while doing something else.

The second concept, and apparently the only concept in 10.12, is "Switch =
to a new space. Blank out all windows, fill this content to the current =
monitor, and make all other monitors useless. Disable space changing".

My computer ** IS FOR MULTITASKING**.
Apple seems to feel "One task to rule them all".

Back in ... was it 10.4? 10.5? I could close a window, and go to the =
next window. I could have multiple spaces, and each space would have =
multiple apps open, and I only had to worry about the windows that were =
on the active space.

Today? I close a window and go to the next window *of that app*. If I'm =
on one space, and close a window, I might get switched to a different =
space to see a window of that same app. The very idea that I might need =
to work with multiple apps to work on a single project? Nope.=20

Apple's approach of Single-app tasking fits the whole "You want full =
screen, you get a space dedicated to one window", and the whole "You =
can't go back to the last window, you go to another window of this app".

It's painful.

My next computer will be linux.

> On 2021-10-31, at 3:53 PM, Macs R We <[email protected]> wrote:
>=20
> Well that was insightful.
>=20
> The behavior seems to be connected with the option, "Displays have =
separate Spaces." I guess it makes sense that OS X might have some =
indigestion figuring out how to split half a page onto "Desktop 2" and =
the other half onto "Desktop 7."
>=20
> When I turned it off, I was able to split a window between two =
displays, mostly (if I dragged more than about half of it onto the lower =
display, it snapped entirely to that display, but I could drag it back =
upwards and get it to stick). But I couldn't grow it to encompass more =
than one display, no matter what I did, which I can achieve trivially =
under Windows (on the Mac).
>=20
> But in that mode, the machine was operationally lobotomized. When you =
flip to a different desktop on one display to double-check a piece of =
data, the data you needed to compare it to on the lower display flips =
away from you. Maybe I'm just too used to working in the "independent =
displays" mode, but that was a non-starter for me, so I won't be using =
it.
>=20
> But thanks for clearing up my question.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>> On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:58 PM, Robert Zusman <[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>=20
>> I suspect that may have something to do with it.
>> My Mojave system splits windows just fine (the left monitor stops =
just after the =E2=80=9Csend mail=E2=80=9D button):
>>=20
>> -RZ
>>=20
>>> On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:54 PM, Macs R We <[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>>=20
>>> Well, I'm using "multiple Desktops" in Mission Control, which =
superseded the original Spaces.
>>>=20
>>>> On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:43 PM, Robert Zusman <[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>> Are you using =E2=80=9CSpaces?=E2=80=9D
>>>>=20
>>>> -RZ
>>>>=20
>>>>> On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:36 PM, Macs R We <[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>> I run a two-display system on my bench, with one display (wall =
mount) positioned over the other (laptop).
>>>>>=20
>>>>> When I was running Windows recently in Parallels (which picks up =
that there are two screens and uses them), I noticed that if I dragged a =
screen halfway between the two displays, it stayed there just fine, =
split between displays. Or, I could grow a screen to encompass both =
displays, giving me stuff like extra-long browser windows or galley =
copies.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> It triggered a long-ago memory of being able to do exactly this on =
the Mac, in the classic OS. But I can't do it today.=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> If I try to drag a window halfway between two monitors, it will =
show a "ghost" copy of the bottom of the window on the lower screen =
until I release the window, then only the upper half of the window will =
show, on the upper screen. (If the displays are arranged side-by-side, a =
similar thing happens, with the partial window available only on the =
leftmost screen.)
>>>>>=20
>>>>> This has resulted numerous times in a "lost window" syndrome, =
where I move a window slightly to the left or right, but inadvertently =
manage to fat-finger it upwards as well. Suddenly the whole window =
vanishes, save for a sliver on the upper screen that is near invisible, =
hidden by the Dock, or whatever. Where did my window go? Mission Control =
shows it as still existing, but it disappears again when I click on it. =
Maddening.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Anyway, my question is, is there a setting I am overlooking =
somewhere on the Mac that would allow the old split-display rendering? =
Obviously, there is no technical reason it can't be done under OS X, =
because WIndows does it running under Parallels under OS X.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> --
> _______________________________________________
> MacOSX-talk mailing list
> [email protected]
> https://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Dual window support on the mac is painful.<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">In older version (10.9.5), left/right =
works just fine. Vertical will sort-of work, if the menu bar is on the =
top window, and the widths of the screens match. And this will work =
*until* you right click. (Or maybe it was when a context menu came up -- =
I never tested in a drawing program where right clicking just changed to =
the other pen.)</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">The real problem is the "full screen" concept.</div><div =
class=3D"">In 10.9.5, "full screen" has two different implementations. =
One is "Make this window content cover this entire screen, but do not =
alter the second screen." This is the *good* system. It lets me use my =
720p monitor to watch a 720p video while doing something else.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The second concept, and =
apparently the only concept in 10.12, is "Switch to a new space. Blank =
out all windows, fill this content to the current monitor, and make all =
other monitors useless. Disable space changing".</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">My computer ** IS FOR =
MULTITASKING**.</div><div class=3D"">Apple seems to feel "One task to =
rule them all".</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Back in ... was it 10.4? 10.5? I could close a window, and go =
to the next window. I could have multiple spaces, and each space would =
have multiple apps open, and I only had to worry about the windows that =
were on the active space.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Today? I close a window and go to the next window *of that =
app*. If I'm on one space, and close a window, I might get switched to a =
different space to see a window of that same app. The very idea that I =
might need to work with multiple apps to work on a single project? =
Nope.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Apple's approach of Single-app tasking fits the whole "You =
want full screen, you get a space dedicated to one window", and the =
whole "You can't go back to the last window, you go to another window of =
this app".</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">It's =
painful.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">My =
next computer will be linux.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On 2021-10-31, at 3:53 PM, Macs R We &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" class=3D"">[email protected]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta=
 http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">Well that was =
insightful.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The =
behavior seems to be connected with the option, "Displays have separate =
Spaces." I guess it makes sense that OS X might have some indigestion =
figuring out how to split half a page onto "Desktop 2" and the other =
half onto "Desktop 7."</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">When I turned it off, I was able to split a window between =
two displays, mostly (if I dragged more than about half of it onto the =
lower display, it snapped entirely to that display, but I could drag it =
back upwards and get it to stick). But I couldn't grow it to encompass =
more than one display, no matter what I did, which I can achieve =
trivially under Windows (on the Mac).</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">But in that mode, the machine was =
operationally lobotomized. When you flip to a different desktop on one =
display to double-check a piece of data, the data you needed to compare =
it to on the lower display flips away from you. Maybe I'm just too used =
to working in the "independent displays" mode, but that was a =
non-starter for me, so I won't be using it.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">But thanks for clearing up my =
question.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:58 PM, Robert Zusman =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" =
class=3D"">[email protected]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">I suspect that may =
have something to do with it.<div class=3D"">My Mojave system splits =
windows just fine (the left monitor stops just after the =E2=80=9Csend =
mail=E2=80=9D button):</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">-RZ</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Oct =
31, 2021, at 2:54 PM, Macs R We &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"=
 class=3D"">[email protected]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">Well, I'm using =
"multiple Desktops" in Mission Control, which superseded the original =
Spaces.<br class=3D""><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote =
type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Oct 31, 2021, at 2:43 PM, =
Robert Zusman &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" =
class=3D"">[email protected]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">Are you using =
=E2=80=9CSpaces?=E2=80=9D<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">-RZ</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Oct =
31, 2021, at 2:36 PM, Macs R We &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"=
 class=3D"">[email protected]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">I run a two-display =
system on my bench, with one display (wall mount) positioned over the =
other (laptop).<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">When =
I was running Windows recently in Parallels (which picks up that there =
are two screens and uses them), I noticed that if I dragged a screen =
halfway between the two displays, it stayed there just fine, split =
between displays. Or, I could grow a screen to encompass both displays, =
giving me stuff like extra-long browser windows or galley =
copies.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">It =
triggered a long-ago memory of being able to do exactly this on the Mac, =
in the classic OS. But I can't do it today.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br=
 class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">If I try to drag a window halfway =
between two monitors, it will show a "ghost" copy of the bottom of the =
window on the lower screen until I release the window, then only the =
upper half of the window will show, on the upper screen. (If the =
displays are arranged side-by-side, a similar thing happens, with the =
partial window available only on the leftmost screen.)</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">This has resulted =
numerous times in a "lost window" syndrome, where I move a window =
slightly to the left or right, but inadvertently manage to fat-finger it =
upwards as well. Suddenly the whole window vanishes, save for a sliver =
on the upper screen that is near invisible, hidden by the Dock, or =
whatever. Where did my window go? Mission Control shows it as still =
existing, but it disappears again when I click on it. =
Maddening.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Anyway, my question is, is there a setting I am overlooking =
somewhere on the Mac that would allow the old split-display rendering? =
Obviously, there is no technical reason it can't be done under OS X, =
because WIndows does it running under Parallels under OS X.</div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: =
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;" =
class=3D"">--</div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div>=
</blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></bloc=
kquote></div></div></div>_______________________________________________<b=
r class=3D"">MacOSX-talk mailing list<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" =
class=3D"">[email protected]</a><br =
class=3D"">https://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk<br =
class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br class=3D""></body></html>=

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