Re: moving IDLE forward (was Re: IDLE in UK Schools)

On 8/5/2015 1:29 PM, Al Sweigart wrote:
> Can we collect a list of software that uses idlelib?

Check 'code search' sites (there seem to be several, but Google's is 
gone) for idlelib imports other than idle or pyshell.main.  If possible, 
separate idle extensions from other software.  In the stdlib, turtledemo 
imports a couple of modules, and something else does too. But this is 
not as issue as we can edit turtledemo.__main__ as needed.

 > I'm not sure if it would affect a significant number of projects.

This would be nice to know.  Research results would be welcome

 >  Since IDLE has always
> been an application rather than a standard library module with a
> published API, I don't feel like this should hold back IDLE development.
> (Or am I wrong in this view of idlelib?)

No. PEP 434 (2013) defines idlelib other than defines entry sites as 
'private' (and I need to document this better).

A *limited* exemption is made for extensions, especially those using the 
defined interface.  How many poke elsewhere? Don't know.  I am going to 
try to add deprecation warnings.

> Many of the changes that I'd like to see are cosmetic or new features
> instead of restructuring. The single window, tabbed design is the only
> non-trivial UI change, and even then it's reusing PyShellEditorWindow
> and OutputWindow instead of creating new UI components.
>
> Using the post-8.5 widgets really would improve the look of IDLE, but
> personally I don't mind if these have to be held off until 3.6.

No need.

> We'll have our work cut out even without maintaining
 > two sets of widgets just for 3.5.

I do not intend to do that. The old files will be left alone once new 
files are in place.

> Overall, I'd defer to Mark and Terry's judgement. My current plan is to
> get more familiar with ttk (Mark's book has been great!)

It and his arrival gave me the confidence that we could go ahead.

> and the code
> base, and also think of what "new contributor" documents we should write up.

Bug me in a week to make a draft of a file list that you can review and 
revise.

> Are there any bug issues and mailing list threads that would be in
> particular good for new contributors?

I just posted a list of all open Idle issues categorized mostly by menu 
items.

Since you listed a pip gui as a killer feature, how about working on 
that?  https://bugs.python.org/issue23551  If you do, ask 'sahutd' if he 
will share whatever he has done.  Also see Donald Stufft's offer to help 
with the pip side.  It is a 'nice' issue from my viewpoint because Mark 
and others can review as well as I.  Integration into a menu is close to 
trivial.  There is a possibility that it might live other than in 
idlelib, so as to be obviously available more generally.

-- 
Terry Jan Reedy