Re: SA-ML anyone? (oh so very long)

Ok, as a silent part of the list up until now, and having
to digest this, I thought I'd throw my $0.02 in, as well
as about 19 years of Unix (TM) experience :-).

> For my part, I've been more inclined to keep the object
> model and ditch all the XML-ism :-)

Agreed.  XML is over-hyped, and just because you can do a thing
in XML doesn't mean we should.

> (a) Grokkability by Real Sysadmins (TM) -- I have a constant
> worry about "this stuff is too hairy, and no-one will touch
> it" re ARK things.

I don't intend this rather long diatribe to be taken as a
flame or an "Anti-ARK" thing.  Just one old man's opinion:

ARK really needs to be simplier for a real world Sysadmin to use it.  
Most sys-admins write their stuff in good ol' Bourne Shell. Why?  It's
simple.  For me, if I do more than 5 lines of Bourne, I want to haul out
Perl.

I looked at ARK, and decided it was too complex to understand in
under an hour.  That's the real world, I'm afraid.  I don't have
time... my phone's ringing off the hook with "real work".  I've
got to get it, fast.  And get real work done with it quickly.

But I still want to have an object model that takes things
into account, like:

   OS dependancies (the difference between Solaris 7 and Solaris 8)
   Machine dependanices (I'm running on X86 or Sparc)
   Normal site configuration (yeah, put it in /usr/local...)
   For this group of users/hosts (maybe hardware dependant)
   Options I generally want for this package.

I, as a sysadmin want NOT to have to think about:

    Does this type of machine use gcc, or cc, or ????
    What libraries does this package need?
    Is it Solaris or AIX?
    Where are they on this class of box, or this particular box?
    I have this special group of boxes, what are the exceptions?
      (I only want to define that once).

For example, I want to really say to something:

	"Hey.  Take this Gnugrep package and install it on all machines"

or maybe:

	Install this Foobar patch for me (obviously you need Foobar
        on the box in question, but I don't want to think about it).

I don't want to write translations.
I don't want to write code unless I have to.
I want to understand the model quickly:

    A simple object base
    Look at Java/C# as a "pattern" for OO languages.
    With polymorphism, inhertiance, etc.

I want class libraries, I can just install without thinking (e.g.
Solaris 7 vs 8).

It has to be ROBUST!  And not screw up my boxes... a bad tool is
worse than no tool.  Think transactions like a database.

Doesn't need to be in XML.  It's OK, but concentrate on the WHAT you
want ARK to become before you figure out HOW it's to do it.

Sorry for any flammage... just my weird opinion.

	-=R=-




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