Re: Ang: Announcement: Opera-Users mailing list to be closed in late July, 2010

Hi Julian,

No bubble has been burst - my reasons for disliking Yahoo and preferring Google have nothing to do with the EULAs, but rather because Yahoo's entire service feels much more cluttered and spam-riddled than Google's (not because Yahoo themselves are spamming, but because they are either targeted to a greater extent and/or do a poorer job of filtering it out than Google).  I'm all for privacy - as you can see, I decline to use my full name here, although I do not harbor any illusions that a dedicated individual could not track back to my full identity - but a mailing list is certainly not a place where one should expect privacy of communications.  Even if we were using private mail servers, unless we were encrypting our messages there would be no guarantee that the server maintainers were not
  snooping the communications, or that some security breach might throw our unencrypted communications to light.

If we're headed to Yahoo, I'll follow along.  Honestly, beyond joining to the list, it doesn't make much of a difference.

Cheers,
David

On Tue, 06 Jul 2010 11:43:30 -0400, Julian <[email protected]> wrote:

> Hello David:
>
>       You wrote:
>
>> I don't like Yahoo, either.  I'd prefer Google Groups over it.  Having a
>> privately-owned and run service sounds best to me, but of course that
>> doesn't have the lasting potential of Yahoo or Google.  It may be
>> premature to be thinking of that, though!
>>
>> David
>
>       Hate to burst your bubble, but, if you read
> the EULA of Google's and the one of Yahoo's, you
> will see a few interesting and important
> differences.  Actually, there are only two very
> big differences between them:  control and privacy.
>
>       Have you read either EULA?  When I
> considered a gmail account, I read the document.
> It stated that Google had the right to share any
> and all information it had about me and any and
> all data found in anything I put through Google.
> This included, but not limited to, names and
> addresses of people and places, and any and all
> content I might place in e-mail messages to people
> and organizations.  It continued by saying that if
> I agree to the EULA, then I am agreeing to their
> sharing that with government, retailers, people
> who have partnered with them, advertizers, and to
> anyone they decide to give my information.
>
>       Now, we are not just talking about messages
> sent through e-mail lists, like this one, but,
> private messages sent by one user directly to
> another user.  Even this would not be sooooo bad,
> if it were not the fact that Google does not have
> to have a valid reason, nor that Google must tell
> you it has done this.  There is no way to say,
> "No," without its meaning you do not wish to have
> that e-mail account.  I now have a gmail account,
> but have not used it.
>
>       Yahoo, OT other H, provides a way to prevent
> much of what is automatic at Google, to happen at
> Yahoo.  No, it is not a guarantee.  But it does
> mean you will receive less spam, because it will
> not be due to them.  It also means that if they
> believe they must share what is in your private
> account with anyone, they must and will notify you
> (of course, providing they are allowed to do so).
>
>       And, again, SFA preventing those not members
> from reading what is on the list, that has to do
> with the controls an owner and/or moderator use,
> supposedly.  I say supposedly (and, this is more
> for Harry and John) because I just did a Google
> search of my name.  I did it without logging onto
> Google.  I found a listing of one of the times I
> wrote something through this OperaUsers list.
>
>       Now, granted, I did not go to the OU site
> and read anything, but, it was still there for
> anyone to read.  The date on that was July 18,
> 2006.  I believe we were using the same server
> program in use now?  So much for debating the
> privacy of one group mailing list over that of
> another.  Should be interesting to find what shows
> up if all I do is to search for '"OU" group list'.
>
>                       Julian.
>
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