Minutes, 1 March 2007 WS Description WG telcon
"Jonathan Marsh" <[email protected]> Thu, 1 Mar 2007 10:15:47 -0800
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Enclosed! Jonathan Marsh - <http://www.wso2.com> http://www.wso2.com - <http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com> http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
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<h1>WS Description WG telcon</h1>
<h2>1 Mar 2007</h2>
<p>See also: <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2007/03/01-ws-desc-irc">IRC log</a></p>
<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
<div class="intro">
<dl>
<dt>Present</dt>
<dd>Charlton Baretto, Adobe Systems</dd>
<dd>Roberto Chinnici, Sun Microsystems</dd>
<dd>Youenn Fablet, Canon</dd>
<dd>Ram Jeyaraman, Microsoft</dd>
<dd>Tom Jordahl, Adobe Systems</dd>
<dd>Jacek Kopecky, DERI Innsbruck at the Leopold-Franzens-Universität Innsbruck, Austria</dd>
<dd>Amelia Lewis, TIBCO</dd>
<dd>Jonathan Marsh, Co-chair/WSO2</dd>
<dd>Monica Martin, Sun Microsystems</dd>
<dd>Gilbert Pilz, BEA Systems</dd>
<dd>Tony Rogers, Co-chair/Computer Associates</dd>
<dd>Asir Vedamuthu, Microsoft</dd>
<dt>Regrets</dt>
<dd>Allen Brookes, Rogue Wave Software</dd>
<dd>Paul Downey, British Telecommunications</dd>
<dd>Jean-Jacques Moreau, Canon</dd>
<dt>Chair</dt>
<dd>Jonathan</dd>
<dt>Scribe</dt>
<dd>Tomj</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<h2>Contents</h2>
<ul>
<li>
<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
<ol>
<li><a href="#item01">Approval of minutes</a></li>
<li><a href="#item02">Review of Action items</a></li>
<li><a href="#item03">CR issues</a></li>
<li><a href="#item04">Issue CR147: RFC: operation safety as
semantic annotation?</a></li>
<li><a href="#item05">Issue CR021: Re: WSDL describing
Interface operation safety</a></li>
<li><a href="#item06">Issue CR157: RE: LocationTemplate-1G
test</a></li>
<li><a href="#item07">CR156: Query parameter separator
value</a></li>
<li><a href="#item08">CR155: Proposal for Assertion
InterfaceMessageReference-0042</a></li>
<li><a href="#item09">Document Status</a></li>
<li><a href="#item10">SOAP 1.1 binding, RDF Maping and
Additional MEPs</a></li>
<li><a href="#item11">future telcons</a></li>
<li><a href="#item12">Finally done</a></li>
</ol>
</li>
<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
</ul>
<hr />
<div class="meeting">
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>> Scribe: Tomj</p>
<h3 id="item01">Approval of minutes</h3>
<p class='phone'>Minutes are approved with no comments</p>
<h3 id="item02">Review of Action items</h3>
<pre>Review of Action items [.1].
? 2006-09-21: Jonathan to check periodically that SPARQL has
added schemaLocation.
? 2007-01-04: Paul to report back on which test cases in the
WSDL test suite fail the basic patterns, with
suggestions on how to address the issues.
? 2007-01-11: Jean-Jacques to provide more analysis on how
difficult it would be deal with a Policy that
only contains an MTOM policy assertion
DONE [.3] 2007-02-22: Jonathan to put the proposal on the list for us
to double-check.
DONE [.4] 2007-02-22: Jonathan to figure out what characters can be
used as query separators without causing harm.
DONE [.5] 2007-02-22: Jonathan to send a summary of our URI templating
text to the URI list.
DONE [.6] 2007-02-22: Jonathan to start renumbering discussion.
Current Editorial Action Items
Note: Editorial AIs associated with LC issues recorded at [.2].
[.1] http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/#actions
[.2] http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/actions_owner.html
[.3] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0193.html
[.4] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0200.html
[.5] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/uri/2007Feb/0023.html
[.6] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0204.html</pre>
<p class='phone'>Jonathan reviews his completed actions</p>
<p class='phone'>Others are not in attendance</p>
<h3 id="item03">CR issues</h3>
<h3 id="item04">Issue CR147: RFC: operation safety as semantic
annotation?</h3>
<p class='phone'><a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR147">http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR147</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> Tag wants this to be
doable.<br />
... Tag does not have a preference on where the work is done,
WSDL is fine<br />
... Prefers that the extension be removed from WSDL</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tomj:</cite> Asks for clarification of
issue</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> SAWSDL seems like a better
place to add the safety</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Roberto:</cite> Does saWSDL have
something we can use today?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> there are hooks
available<br />
... We would move WSDL 2.0 safety to saWSDL spec<br />
... a more suitable group to handle</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>TomJ:</cite> doesn't like the syntax,
makes it more complex</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>asir</cite>> Tom, are you using the
safety feature?</p>
<p class='phone'>No, I am not using it</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> Explains to Tom how
implementation might work</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Roberto:</cite> The default behavior in
the HTTP binding is a good thing - REST people in particular
might like it</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> agrees that safety does
help REST</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> saWSDL would specify this
in a cleaner way.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tomj:</cite> Does see a complelling
reason to remove it from WSDL just because another spec could
specify it</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> saWSDL can use the
WSDL2 safety attribute</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Janathan:</cite> Can we leave the status
quo?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tony:</cite> Yes</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> Does not object</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Any objects to closing
CR 147 with no further action? NO</p>
<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: Close
CR147 with no action</strong></p>
<h3 id="item05">Issue CR021: Re: WSDL describing Interface
operation safety</h3>
<p class='phone'><a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR021">http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR021</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Feels we have fulfilled
this action - tracked through CR</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>alewis</cite>> +1</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Janathan:</cite> Proposes we declare
success on this</p>
<p class='phone'>various +1s</p>
<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: Close
CR021</strong></p><a name="action01" id="action01"></a>
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Jonathan report back to the TAG with
status on safety [recorded in <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2007/03/01-ws-desc-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2007/03/01-ws-desc-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>
<h3 id="item06">Issue CR157: RE: LocationTemplate-1G test</h3>
<p class='phone'><a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR157">http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR157</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Any objections to
adopting the editorial improvements in the issue? No</p>
<p class='phone'>Question 1: character encoding</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Proposal is to do
nothing</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tomj:</cite> Implicit assumption that
characters the MAY be encoded can be encoded</p>
<p class='phone'>Question 2: Is this clear in the spec?</p>
<p class='phone'>Tony; Seems like a test suite problem its
doing a dumb comparison not a smart one</p>
<p class='phone'>Discussion about the test suite and how it
should behave</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tony:</cite> believes nothing wrong with
the spec.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Youenn:</cite> Its safer to say that you
MUST encode characters<br />
... should make encoding the default with a SHOULD</p>
<p class='phone'>Discussion about how and why to encode
characters</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>jkaputin_</cite>> reserved =
gen-delims / sub-delims</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>jkaputin_</cite>> gen-delims = ":"
/ "/" / "?" / "#" / "[" / "]" / "@"</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>jkaputin_</cite>> sub-delims = "!"
/ "$" / "&" / "'" / "(" / ")"</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>jkaputin_</cite>> / "*" / "+" / ","
/ ";" / "="</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>> The characters in
the range: ALPHA | DIGIT | "-" | "." | "_" | "~"</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Proposal:</cite> Split the list and move
everything after the ~ to a SHOULD section</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>> "!" | "$" | "'" |
"(" | ")" | "*" | "+" | "," | ";" | "=" | ":" | "@" | "?" |
"/"</p>
<p class='phone'>No other comments?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Any objects to adopting
the proposal? NO</p>
<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: Split
the character encoding table to address questions 2 in CR
157</strong></p>
<p class='phone'>Question 3: Editorial improvements will be
adopted</p>
<p class='phone'>Question 4: Is "&" a harmful character
before the "?". If not, we should</p>
<p class='phone'>add it to the excluded list.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Any object to adding
"&" in to the list of SHOULD characters? NO</p>
<p class='phone'>Question 5: Are ";" and "=" harmful characters
before the "?". If so, we</p>
<p class='phone'>should remove them from the excluded list.</p>
<p class='phone'>Any objections to doing nothing as they are
already in the SHOULD list? NO</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>> telling me the
code isn't valide.</p>
<h3 id="item07">CR156: Query parameter separator value</h3>
<p class='phone'><a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR156">http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/cr-issues/#CR156</a></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>youenn</cite>> <a href=
"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0216.html">
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0216.html</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Youenn:</cite> explains the issue</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Tony:</cite> Any comments? (chirp chirp
of crickets...)<br />
... Recommend that ; and & be added as as the seperated
chars</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>>
[a-zA-Z0-9\-\._~!$&amp;'\(\):@/\?\*\+,;]{1,1}</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>TonyR</cite>> RESOLUTION: accept to
close CR156 Jonathan's proposal, as modified by Jacek, with the
addition of a NOTE as requested by Youenn (NOTE: semicolon and
ampersand most commonly accepted separators)</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>>
[&amp;;a-zA-Z0-9\-\._~!$'\(\):@/\?\*\+,]{1,1}</p>
<h3 id="item08">CR155: Proposal for Assertion
InterfaceMessageReference-0042</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>jonathan:</cite> proposes to put it in
errata list</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jack:</cite> Add errata before we
ship?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Yes, it doesn't affect
the spec in a meaningful way</p>
<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: Put
this issue on our errata list</strong></p>
<h3 id="item09">Document Status</h3>
<p class='irc'><<cite>asir</cite>> Jonathan, am wondering
if you have to replace the &amp; entity ref with a
character reference</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> working group needs to
vote to PR<br />
... Editorial status looks good<br />
... Primer is ready<br />
... Must build set of documents with new namespace<br />
... implementation status looks good, lots of green for
interchange,<br />
... message level tests are about as green as they are going to
get<br />
... should be good enough to proceed<br />
... Proposes to take a vote to go to PR contingent on the
interop report being updated.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>alewis</cite>> tibco +1</p>
<p class='phone'>+1 to vote</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>monica1</cite>> wow!</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>monica1</cite>> :>)</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>jkaputin_</cite>> woo hoo (for
Arthur)</p>
<p class='phone'>No objections to moving to PR</p>
<h3 id="item10">SOAP 1.1 binding, RDF Maping and Additional
MEPs</h3>
<p class='phone'>Do we have permission to publish these three
documents as working drafts?</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Jonathan</cite>> RESOLUTION: Move
Primer, Part 1 and Part 2 to PR.</p>
<p class='phone'>No objections to publishing extra documents as
working drafts at the same time as we do the PR?</p>
<p class='phone'>No objections</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>monica1</cite>> sigh</p>
<h3 id="item11">future telcons</h3>
<p class='phone'>implementors calls will be on demand</p>
<p class='phone'>Next weeks telcon is on, but will hopefully be
canceled if no problems.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>TonyR</cite>> No implementor's call
next week</p>
<p class='phone'>discussion about how errata will be handled
after WSDL goes away (June 2007).</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Jonathan:</cite> Idea of having a
WS-core group that will handle issues for WSDL and other
specs.</p>
<p class='phone'>Congratulations on Shipping the spec!!!</p>
<h3 id="item12">Finally done</h3>
<p class='phone'>almost 5 years of effort are complete</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>monica1</cite>> congrats!</p>
</div>
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Jonathan report
back to the TAG with status on safety [recorded in <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2007/03/01-ws-desc-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2007/03/01-ws-desc-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />
<br />
[End of minutes]<br />
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