Re: What does Five and Z3 mean for Archetypes?

Martijn Faassen wrote:
> Sidnei da Silva wrote:

Hi Martijn,

>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 05:53:19PM +0100, Martijn Faassen wrote:
>> | >AT paradigm   Z3 equiv
>> | >---------     --------
>> | >schemata      Interface inheritance / multiple schema
>> | | So what does schemata do in Archetypes?
>>
>> It's a stupid name for separating widgets in 'groups' for
>> presentation.
> 
> 
> Is this information in the widgets or is there a special group object?

It's a property (called 'schemata') of the individual fields.
There is no special group object. The magic is in the
'base_edit' template where the filtering on schemata sets
occurs (not my idea, though).

> 
> [snip stuff I think I understand]
> 
>> | >marshalling   a view? nothing currently
>> | | What's marshalling exactly?
[..]
> I.e. serialization/deserialization?

Yes. It's just a different term for that.

> Can I understand this as a one word 
> description of what a serializer/deserializer would do or is it doing 
> something else beyond this?

It's also archetypes default for 'manage_FTPget' and friends
(so, e.g,  WebDAV support is based on this). But also external
edit.

> 
>> This feature is also very underused currently. I'm probably the
>> (only?) one that uses it. We hope to change that with the 'Marshall'
>> product, which lets you control which marshaller gets used through a
>> UI. Sort of a local adapter registry.
> 
> 
> I understood that Kapil's XML work was doing stuff with the marshalling 
> functionality as well.

Yes. There are currently two lines of improvement on the
marshalling side:

1. Make it more flexible in terms of which marshaller
    can be used for what purpose and when (basically
    Sidnei's ControlledMarshaller; currently you define one
    marshaller in the schema declaration and then you are stuck
    with it - no way to control at runtime (user request) which
    marshaller to use)

2. Provide better/more powerful marshallers (per default, AT only has
    an RFC822Marshaller and a PrimaryFieldMarshaller). This is where
    Kapil's work on XML marshalling fits in. One goal there is to be
    able to have full, round-trip safe import/export support for
    content including *all* metadata (like creation date, modification
    date(s), workflow history, local roles, etc)

> 
> One would imagine that this could be rewritten in terms of Zope 3 
> adapters and such eventually, or is marshall in Archetypes doing 
> something particularly ingenious not yet supported by Zope 3?

Not that I know, so yes, it should be all doable in Zope 3
via adapters.

> Is the goal of the marshalling support just import/export, or different 
> representations for view purposes as well? 

As mentioned, it's also used for FTP/WebDAV/external edit views
(if one can call it that way)

> In Silva the XML export 
> system's product is not only used for export purposes but is also used 
> to drive the XSLT transformations for individual content objects, for 
> instance.

AFAIK, this has not been a usecase for AT so far, but it is
obvious that this would become possible given Kapil's xmlio now.

Raphael
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Martijn
> 
> 
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