Re: broken jenkins and PloneTestCase magic

Am 04.12.2014 um 23:30 schrieb Jens W. Klein:
> On 2014-12-04 21:18, Timo Stollenwerk wrote:
>> Am 03.12.14 11:33, schrieb Timo Stollenwerk:
>>> Am 03.12.2014 um 09:48 schrieb Jens W. Klein:
>>>> I love the smell of a red jenkins in the morning...
>>>>
>>>> Yesterday I broke the build - but I do not revert that fats ;) maybe one
>>>> of you now how to fix this.
>>
>> Jens, please revert your commits. The build is broken for two days now.
>> I would like to work on the control panels and you are essentially
>> blocking any further Plone development for no good reason.
> 
> Well, I'd rather like to see this fixed. All this crazy mixed/ 
> inconsistent test setup blocks more the development than any other task.
> 
> The good reason to not revert was to get some input how to solve such 
> problems.

So you are saying you left the build broken just to make a point that
the problem you found is so important that an email to the mailing list
is not sufficient?

> We have a real problem in our setup, but instead of fixing it 
> we better revert changes to see a green button. Thats an insane process, 
> sorry.

I completely disagree and I think you fundamentally misunderstand what a
CI system is for. A green button does not mean everything is ok at all.
The main purpose of a CI system is to inform developers of regressions
they might cause (green build -> red build) and a red build for two days
makes it very hard to track those new regressions and inform developers
about it, if other people commit on a broken build (red build -> red build).

Nobody who takes our tests seriously can work with a build broken like
this and I don't see how a single problem can justify to stop all
development of Plone. We are quite a few developers and you basically
force everybody who wants to work on Plone to fix "your" problem first.
You are saying "the problem I have discovered is more important than any
other problem that could possibly occur and any work that might be in
progress".

Do we really want a development process where one person can just stop
everybody else whenever they think they found an important problem? Do
you really want to tell a newbie Plone core dev that he or she should
fix this problem first before committing a minor fix?

I agree that we are all responsible to work on complicated problems and
you have every right to ask us all to help. We are all grateful for your
work and your contributions. Though, you don't have the right to force
your opinion on other developers like this in my opinion.

I wanted to work on the control panels yesterday and I was waiting for a
green build. Since you wrote that you don't want to revert I thought
that the revert would be hard to do (many packages, merge conflicts), so
I didn't do it. I just asked you to revert. I tried to run the tests for
the package I planed to work on, to see if I can work around it and they
failed. Then I stopped.

If I work on Plone in my free time I want to be at least able to choose
myself on what part I want to work on. In order to get started, your
move forced me to fix the build first, before I can start with what I
planed to do. While it would take you a few seconds to revert your
commit, it takes me quite some time because I have to figure out first
what went wrong. This is a highly inefficient and unfair process in my
opinion.

If you think our CI process/rules can be improved, please feel free to
propose changes. I'm open for suggestions. Though, we agreed on our
current CI process and as long as we do not change it, I'd ask everybody
to stick with it.

> I'll revert as soon as I can. At the moment I dont have my dev 
> environment here. Its just the one commit in Products.CMFlone which is 
> the problem, the others were fine. So if you  need it now please fell 
> free to revert yourself.

I reverted. Let's see what Jenkins says...

Timo

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