Re: Re: A strawman proposal for X.org & XFree86.org

On Monday 31 March 2003 02:19, Ben Jansens wrote:
|  On Sun, Mar 30, 2003 at 10:12:01PM +0400, Vadim Plessky wrote:
|  > On Sunday 30 March 2003 20:48, Christoph Hellwig wrote:
|  > |  On Sun, Mar 30, 2003 at 07:23:47PM +0400, Vadim Plessky wrote:
|  > |  > Well, GNOME and KDE cover together about 95% of Linux Desktops.
|  > |
|  > |  Where did you get this estimate from?
|  >
|  > That number has been discussed/quoted many times.
|  > Estimation I have seen and feel comfortable with os that KDE has 60%
|  > share, and GNOME - 30%, while the rest is splitted around other WMs or
|  > environments. My estimationn though that KDE has slightly higher share
|  > (about 65%), so combined GNOME+KDE is about 95%
|
|  Well I'm glad we have an estimate that you feel comfortable with instead
| of a solid emperical result. I don't know of any reliable studies done
| which can give a number to this statistic. Forums polls just wont do for
| accurate data.

Those figures have nothing to do with forum polls.
Check http://www.ofb.biz, Mandrake is clear leader (which is not the case if 
you take paid Linux boxes with per-seat license or whatever)

|
|  > |  > Should XFree86 make focus on 95% of its users or focus on needs of
|  > |  > minority?
|  > |
|  > |  XFree86 should not enforce policy on toolkits/windowmanagers _at
|  > | all_.
|  >
|  > Well, toolkit/desktop users want , say, window transparency - and
|  > developers for those toolkits/desktops can't implement transparency
|  > until it's get done on XFree86 level.
|  > Like it or not, but XFree86 has influence on all GUI-based Linux/*BSD
|  > apps.
|
|  Everything seems to always come down to transparency. In my option, this
| is a small issue to the overall development of the XFree project. I think
| far to much emphasis is put on this in arguments for server enhancements.

MacOS X has it, so I think we should have it too.

|
|  > |  successfull because it doesn't enforce policy.  You can use gnome/kde
|  > |  or twm+xterm over the same protocol, with the same hardware drivers
|  > | and even use some gnome app under twm or the other way around. 
|  > | Changing this is a very bad idea.
|  >
|  > You can't use modern X apps (KDE, GNOME) with TWM, or other not
|  > NetWM-enabled Window Manager. This is just one example.
|
|  While this is not even entirely true, I'll give you the benefit of the
| doubt since _some_ things about these applications may not behave correctly
| in a WM without NetWM support. This is not an example of how the X server

Have you ever tried Konqueror or Kmail or nautilus from TWM?

| needs to be updated to meet the needs of the "95%" however. This is
| entirely a protocol between one client and another.
|
|  Ben

-- 
Best Regards,

Vadim Plessky
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