Re: Re: concern at copyright ruling

That's a good point Chris, and unfortunately not so ridiculous. 
Outsourcing is well practiced. And a lot of books are already printede 
in Asia,so shipping costs won't change. Of course it could hurt the US 
economy even so...

Joseph

On 21/03/2013 15:18, Robotech_Master wrote:
>
> It would also mean that publishers could kill off future used book
> sales by moving their printing operations overseas, which would cost
> American jobs and incur a lot of extra shipping costs. Which is really
> kind of ridiculous.
>
> On 3/21/13, Chris <[email protected] <mailto:smith%40vex.net>> wrote:
> >
> > I think it is worth noting that the particulars of this case do not
> > represent
> > the foreign publisher shipping crates of books to a U.S. bookstore. 
> In this
> >
> > case, individuals bought the books in Thailand, and at that point, 
> exhausted
> >
> > the publisher's control over distribution. These books were already
> > legitimately sold once - the triggering point in the first sale 
> doctrine.
> >
> > Essentially, Wiley was asking for a block on used books that originated
> > outside
> > the U.S. To establish that as part of copyright would have meant 
> sweeping
> > changes for how books get resold would be read into copyright law, 
> and that
> > was
> > something the court could not countenance. It would mean that if, as a
> > traveller, you visited a foreign country and bought a book, you 
> could not
> > pass
> > it on to anyone when you returned to the U.S. The difference between 
> that
> > and
> > what Kirtsaeng was doing is a difference in scale only.
> >
> > Note that the ruling only says that publisher's will find it "more 
> difficult
> > to
> > charge different prices for the same book in different geographic 
> markets".
> > It
> > does not say that it will be impossible, or that it is not allowed. It
> > appears
> > to me that this control would have to rest within contract law, not 
> within
> > copyright law.
> >
> > ... Chris
> >
> > (thank you for including the link to the decision - more people 
> should take
> > the
> > time to read these before commenting)
> >
> > On Wed, 20 Mar 2013, josephHarris wrote:
> >
> >> I'd been following the reasoning in the majority decision without too
> >> much problem, but that did not last.
> >> http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/12pdf/11-697_d1o2.pdf
> >>
> >> "Third, Wiley and the dissent claim that a nongeograph­ical
> >> interpretation will make it difficult, perhaps impos­sible, for
> >> publishers (and other copyright holders) to divide foreign and domestic
> >> markets. We concede that is so. A publisher may find it more difficult
> >> to charge different prices for the same book in different geographic
> >> markets. But we do not see how these facts help Wiley, for we can find
> >> no basic principle of copyright law that suggests that publishers are
> >> especially entitled to such rights". [p31 of the majority ruling]
> >>
> >> I cannot see why there needs to be explicit consent in the Acts, if
> >> there is control of copies. If control of copies does not include
> >> control of price is not control lost, or at least weakened?
> >>
> >> I am at least on the same page as Justice Ginsberg
> >>
> >> "Cite as: 568 U. S. ____ (2013) 33 GINSBURG, J., dissenting 
> 8--184.34 to
> >> 8--184.35; 2 Goldstein §7.6.1.2(a), at 7:141; 4 Patry §§13:22, 13:44,
> >> 13:44.10. [JUSTICE GINSBURG, with whom JUSTICE KENNEDY joins, and with
> >> whom JUSTICE SCALIA joins except as to Parts III and V--B--1,
> >> dissenting.]
> >> "Rather than adopting the very international-exhaustion rule the United
> >> States has consistently resisted in international-trade negotiations, I
> >> would adhere to the national-exhaustion framework set by the Copyright
> >> Act's text and history. Under that regime, codified in §602(a)(1),
> >> Kirtsaeng's unauthorized importation of the foreign-made textbooks
> >> involved in this case infringed Wiley's copyrights. I would therefore
> >> affirm the Second Circuit's judgment." [p33 of the Dissent]
> >>
> >> I am personally relieved that the point I immediately picked up here is
> >> both conceded in the majority ruling and underlined by the dissenting
> >> opinion. :-)
> >
> > : chris smith ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
> > : nihil tam munitum quod non expugnari pecunia possit - cicero :
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------
> > Post a message: ebook-community [[at]] *
> > Unsubscribe: ebook-community-unsubscribe [[at]] *
> > Switch to digest: ebook-community-digest [[at]] *
> > Switch to normal: ebook-community-normal [[at]] *
> > Put mail on hold: ebook-community-nomail [[at]] *
> > Administrator: ebook-community-owner [[at]] *
> >
> > (* == yahoogroups.com)
> > -------------------------------------------------------Yahoo! Groups 
> Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> -- 
> Chris Meadows aka | WWW: http://www.terrania.us | Somebody
> Robotech_Master | ICQ: 5477383 AIM: RoboMastr | help, I'm
> [email protected] <mailto:robotech.master%40gmail.com> | 
> Skype, LJ-Gizmo: Robotech_Master | trapped in
> [email protected] <mailto:robotech%40eyrie.org> | Facebook: 
> Robotech.Master | a sig file!
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------
Post a message:   ebook-community [[at]] *
Unsubscribe:      ebook-community-unsubscribe [[at]] *
Switch to digest: ebook-community-digest [[at]] *
Switch to normal: ebook-community-normal [[at]] *
Put mail on hold: ebook-community-nomail [[at]] *
Administrator:    ebook-community-owner [[at]] *

(* == yahoogroups.com)
-------------------------------------------------------Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ebook-community/

<*> Your email settings:
    Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ebook-community/join
    (Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
    [email protected] 
    ebook-community-fullfeatured-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@public.gmane.org

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ebook-community-unsubscribe-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@public.gmane.org

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/