Re: Requesting support for a community-wide open le

salaam afdhere,

specifics please.  what anti war movement are you talking about?

the movement that i am involved with very very specifically connects u.s.
imperialism with the occupation of and apartheid in palestine, global
capitalist exploitation of resources, to a zillion other social justice
issues, including kurdistan and the rise of fascism in india etc. etc.

so what specifically are you talking about.  give examples of actual
organizations, actual movements.

masalaama,

itrath


on 1/22/04 10:05 PM, Afdhere Jama at [email protected] wrote:

> 
> 
> 
> salam, elieen, 
> 
> actually, my views are beyond zionism. and, btw, please lets not forget
> anti-semitism is a bit older than zionism... and that not too long ago
> (2001?)... the majority of american jewry did not consider themselves
> zionists. 
> 
> eileen, be honest. how many times do you hear about kashmir in the anti-war
> movement? how about kurdistan? what about ogaden? they are not all in one
> continent. when people pick and choose atrocities in the world, something
> fishy is up, sister. i'm serious. folks like the short-term gratifitication. i
> worry more when people concentrate more on palestinians than anyone else :)
> 
> afdhere
> Afdhere Jama 
> Editorial Director
> HURIYAH Publications
> S A N F R A N C I S C O
> [email protected]  <mailto:[email protected]>
> http://www.huriyahmag.org
> 
> 
>> From: "kas2eileen" >Reply-To: [email protected] >To:
>> >Subject: Re: [Progressivemuslimsnetwork] Requesting support for a
>> community-wide open le >Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2004 16:32:45 -0500 > >salaam
>> Afdhere, I must object to your statements as they sound very inverted. We
>> point out Israel's bad actions out of anti-Semitism? We point it out instead
>> of others bad actions? I don't think so and I think you are close friends
>> with some rabid Zionists because for months this is the way you present your
>> viewpoints. The anti war movement is against all war. The Zionists who are
>> also liberals want to remove Israel from the table of anti war actions to
>> protect themselves from conflicts of interest and they shut people up by
>> calling legitimate criticism 'anti Semitic" I don't expect to see such
>> invalidation here. If Israel did want it should half the terrorism and
>> hostility toward Jews would dry up. or better. Many not anti Semitic people
>> have nevertheless become critics of Israel as they learn the facts and
>> Americans are paying for this stuff out of our earnings so we have a right to
>> criticize. Eileen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Afdhere Jama > To:
>> [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004
>> 2:37 AM > Subject: Re: [Progressivemuslimsnetwork] Requesting support for a
>> community-wide open le > > > > > > > salam, sister charmi, > > the anti-war
>> movement is a worldwide thingy :) not just american. > > many times, i think
>> many jewish americans became zionists simply because of anti-semitism
>> launched on jews by supposed "peace" and "freedom" loving people. it is
>> certainly a reactionary of the first order... but one that can be understood.
>> > > the thing is that the first thing to justice... must be consistency. one
>> of the main reasons why arabs - for example - are not easily *won* by america
>> is that america is not consistent. and the same goes for all sides of the
>> coins. the anti-war movement becomes a joke... if it concentrates on
>> palestine more than it does on -- say -- kashmir or kurdistan. > > i usually
>> smell anti-semitism when people want to concentrate on the horrible things
>> israel does... completely ignoring the horrible things other people do. all
>> pain is the same. if that is not the way the soup is made, something is
>> smelling... and it is not the fish :) > > > afdhere > > Afdhere Jama >
>> Editorial Director > HURIYAH Publications > S A N F R A N C I S C O >
>> [email protected] > http://www.huriyahmag.org > > >From: Charmi Miller
>> >Reply-To: [email protected] >To:
>> [email protected] >Subject: Re:
>> [Progressivemuslimsnetwork] Requesting support for a community-wide open le
>> >Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 13:01:25 -0500 > >hi br afdhere, > >well, i
>> absolutely agree with you that it is a situation of a people >being warred
>> upon like any other people being warred upon. i wasn't >saying emphasize it
>> over any other situation of occupation and war. > >what i read in what br
>> na'eem posted -- and i may have mis-read it >because i don't feel all that
>> well and was kind of scanning -- was that >there were people who wanted the
>> war on palestine to be removed from >anti-war work. i might have just
>> misunderstood. > >but, in terms of why this situation appears to eclipse
>> other situations >in the minds of americans: you always have to keep in mind
>> that one of >the reasons why what's happening to palestinians is so terribly
>> >intolerable to americans is that WE are the ones warring on them - our
>> >money, our weapons, even our citizens in many cases. > >(not to mention the
>> hidden funding from US citizens and organizations >that makes the funds for
>> the war machine pretty much limitless. i just >can't stop wondering WHEM they
>> are going to get around to freezing the >funds of US individuals and
>> organizations that launder such huge amounts >of money which are funneled to
>> support IDF/fringe group "terrorism"? << >i'm opposed to the use of that word
>> since it has now lost all meaning. >this willingness to overlook
>> money-laundering if it's bound for israel >is one of the biggest twilight
>> zone aspects of this to me... i wouldn't >be surprised if the IRS switching
>> their focus to this area of fraud >wouldn't result in a big dent being made
>> in the national debt.) > >being citizens of a supposed democracy, we should
>> have the means to put >a stop to our money being used in these ways. this is
>> only what "should >be", obviously. the reality of our government and its
>> selective >definition of "democracy" is a whole different story.... > >charmi
>> > >p.s. br afdhere i hear ya where you ask the question "what if it were
>> >jews?" things have gotten so bad here in the US about palestine/israel >that
>> i find that many if not most of my jewish friends have so easily >slipped
>> into newfound zionism, though they tend to call it other things, >such as
>> "finding their roots", that i am actually scared by things they >say. as a
>> result of what i see right around me, i try extra hard to >constantly keep a
>> watch on myself for reactionary responses to things i >read or hear about
>> israel. and there's a certain 'tone of voice' which >causes some automatic
>> filtering when i read or hear certain phrases, >such as anti-semitism. yes,
>> we all have to keep an eye on our own >biases, whether they're new ones or
>> old ones, no matter where they came >from. no doubt. ;) > >
>> >_______________________________________________ >ProgressiveMuslims mailing
>> list >[email protected]
>> >http://willo.nitric.co.za/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/progressivemuslims > >
>> >----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -- > Rethink your business approach for the new year with the helpful tips
>> here. _______________________________________________ ProgressiveMuslims
>> mailing list [email protected]
>> http://willo.nitric.co.za/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/progressivemuslims
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed
> experience. <http://g.msn.com/8HMAENUS/2743??PS=>
> _______________________________________________ ProgressiveMuslims mailing
> list [email protected]
> http://willo.nitric.co.za/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/progressivemuslims