CryoNet #31725 - #31726

CryoNet - Sun 7 Jun 2009

    #31725: Saving people from the past [Brook Norton]
    #31726: the free radical theory of aging still attracts funding [oberon]

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Message #31725
From: Brook Norton <[email protected]>
Subject: Saving people from the past
Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 20:01:00 -0700

It might be possible, via the reverse-time computation that's been  
discussed recently on Cryonet, to resurrect the dead (first in  
simulation and then in reality). I hope it is.

The computing power would need to be somewhere between Windows Vista  
and God; closer to God. But I have high hopes for our ultimate  
computing power (if we don't kill ourselves in the journey).

But a few things are in our favor, I think. First, Mike Perry  
mentioned the school of thought (attributed to someone else I believe)  
of using past photos, stories, etc, as boundary conditions. This is  
powerful. It could stop the slow build up of divergent errors. Think  
how powerful the fossil record is that we are unearthing these days.  
The reverse-time simulation would need to be so close to reality that  
it simulated the dead dinosaur, in its exact position and location,  
millions of years ago, boding well for the simulation's accuracy in  
the near-past when lost relatives lived. It seems to me there would  
only be a few very similar, or perhaps only one, past series of events  
that could honor every boundary condition. That is, in order for the  
sim to work, and match all photos, videos, fossils, etc, fed into it,  
it would need to make a near perfect interpolation between boundary  
conditions, thus simulating all physical events with great accuracy,  
down to the simulation of each person, and their exact state, their  
exact thoughts, with little or no information fed into the sim  
specifically about that person!

Second, like Ettinger and others, it seems likely to me that the  
universe is deterministic. Quantum mechanics appears non-deterministic  
from our viewpoint, in our four dimensions, in our universe (as  
opposed to the multiverse). I bet that once we figure out how to take  
into account 5+ dimensions and the effect of other universes in our  
multiverse, that quantum mechanics will be able to be understood in  
deterministic terms. For example, Einstein's "spooky action at a  
distance" where quantumly entangled particles, separated by any  
distance you like, can affect each other "instantly". Well, I believe  
in cause-and-effect, and this would seem to violate cause-and-effect  
because there is no way for separated particles to instantly cause the  
other to be affected. Seems to me the separate particles must be  
"touching" in other dimensions, or time quirks (tachyons?), or  
something explainable. Also, as Ettinger has also mentioned, a  
"random" event seems illogical; rationally impossible (but this a  
whole discussion in itself). This all means that our reverse-time  
simulator can deal with a deterministic calculation, not an infinity  
of past possibilities; just one past possibility (from a multiverse  
perspective).

Third, I don't think the flow of events is as fluid and flexible as is  
often described. I've heard the multiverse described where every  
quantum possibility spawns a new branch of the universe where each  
possibility is realized. It is then implied that this leads to a  
separate universe where every possible event takes place; like a  
universe where Obama is elected, where Bush is reelected, where Ron  
Paul is elected (put me in that one), where EVERY person is elected.  
But I don't think there is a possible chain of events that could lead  
to every person being elected. I think many possibilities you could  
talk about, do not have a possible chain of events that could lead to  
that possibility in reality. So while the reverse-time simulator may  
have an infinite number of universes to deal with, its a lower order  
infinity than many might think. Hopefully, the boundary conditions  
described earlier would lead to a finite calculation for the  
simulation, as an infinite number of calculations could take a very  
long time.

Brook Norton

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Message #31726
Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 21:02:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: [email protected]
Subject: the free radical theory of aging still attracts funding

[Hard to say what it would take to choke off funding for this now
discredited theory of aging. This is the Eveready Energizer bunny of
aging theories. It just keeps going, and going, and going...]

FASEB J. 2009 Jun 1. [Epub ahead of print]
Lack of methionine sulfoxide reductase A in mice increases sensitivity to oxidative stress but does not diminish life span.
  Salmon AB, Perez VI, Bokov A, Jernigan A, Kim G, Zhao H, Levine RL, Richardson A. *The Sam and Ann Barshop Institute for Longevity and Aging Studies,Department of Cellular and Structural Biology, andDepartment of Physiology, The University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio, San Antonio, Texas, USA;Laboratory of Biochemistry, National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute, National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, Maryland, USA; and||The Geriatric Research Education and Clinical Center, South Texas Veterans Health Care System, San Antonio, Texas, USA.
  Methionine sulfoxide reductase A (MsrA) repairs oxidized methionine residues within proteins and may also function as a general antioxidant. Previous reports have suggested that modulation of MsrA in mice and mammalian cell culture can affect the accumulation of oxidized proteins and may regulate resistance to oxidative stress. Thus, under the oxidative stress theory of aging, these results would predict that MsrA regulates the aging process in mammals. We show here that MsrA(-/-) mice are more susceptible to oxidative stress induced by paraquat. Skin-derived fibroblasts do not express MsrA, but fibroblasts cultured from MsrA(-/-) mice were, nevertheless, also more susceptible to killing by various oxidative stresses. In contrast to previous reports, we find no evidence for neuromuscular
  dysfunction in MsrA(-/-) mice in either young adult or in older animals. Most important, we found no difference between MsrA(-/-) and control mice in either their median or maximum life span. Thus, our results show that MsrA regulates sensitivity to oxidative stress in mice but has no effect on aging, as determined by life span.-Salmon, A. B., Perez, V. I., Bokov, A., Jernigan, A., Kim, G., Zhao, H., Levine, R. L., Richardson, A. Lack of methionine sulfoxide reductase A in mice increases sensitivity to oxidative stress but does not diminish life span.
PMID: 19487311

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