CryoNet #32800 - #32804
CryoNet <[email protected]> 31 Aug 2010 09:00:03 -0000
| Newsgroups | gmane.culture.science.cryogenics |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
CryoNet - Tue 31 Aug 2010
#32800: Thank you, Kevin Brown, for hosting Cryonet [Rudi Hoffman]
#32801: "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry" [MARK PLUS]
#32802: Free Speech and Alcor's Membership Dues [Melody Maxim]
#32803: Re: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry... [John de Rivaz]
#32804: Fw: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry... [John de Rivaz]
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Message #32800
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2010 09:00:09 -0400
Subject: Thank you, Kevin Brown, for hosting Cryonet
From: Rudi Hoffman <[email protected]>
--002215b03bb65efeeb048f0a0bc4
To Kevin Q. Brown:
Thank you very much for hosting Cryonet, and maintaining archives in a
fairly accessible fashion.
While other cryonics themed bulletin boards have come and gone, Cryonet
remains a fixture.
Indeed, a fixture with a sometimes uneven noise to signal ratio, but a good
forum nonetheless.
Like other components of cryonics and many endeavors in life, hosting
cryonet is probably mostly a rather thankless
job. But, I am appreciative of this forum, and glad that it is here. And
appreciative of most of the posts/ posters as well.
Let's make this a fun, positive, productive day.
Rudi
--
Rudi Richard Hoffman CFP CLU ChFC
World's Leading Cryonics Insuror rudihoffman.com
Former Board Member Financial Planning Association fpafla.com
Board Member Salvation Army salvationarmy.org
Member Alcor Life Extension Foundation alcor.org,
Member Cryonics Institute cryonics.org
Certified Financial Planner(TM) CFP Board of Standards
Member World Transhumanist Association http://transhumanism.org/
Securities offered through Broker Dealer Financial Services Corp. Member
FINRA and SIPC.
--002215b03bb65efeeb048f0a0bc4
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Message #32801
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2010 07:41:47 -0700
Subject: "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry"
From: MARK PLUS <[email protected]>
As I've suspected, cryonics organizations might have made an error a
generation ago by identifying revival scenarios too closely to certain
technological speculations which haven't born fruit:
http://scottlocklin.wordpress.com/2010/08/24/nano-nonsense-25-years-of-charlatanry/
--
Mark Plus
Life is short: Freeze hard!
Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=32801
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Message #32802
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2010 15:01:10 +0000 (UTC)
From: Melody Maxim <[email protected]>
Subject: Free Speech and Alcor's Membership Dues
I recently wrote a blog entry, regarding Alcor's propensity for doing "last-minute" cases and/or "charity" cases, something I consider to be a slap in the face to conscientious cryonicists who have diligently filled out Alcor's extensive paperwork, taken the trouble to make sure their legal affairs are in order for cryopreservation, and loyally paid their dues. (This all started when an Alcor member told me he had not been paying his dues, and drew my attention to an article in which Alcor had noted that a lot of members were behind on their dues.) In addition, I probably stated my opinion that I don't consider the quality of Alcor's services to be deserving of such high price tags. I cross-posted to the Cold Filter (CF) cryonics forum, and all hell broke loose.
The anonymous CF regular, "FD," pretended to be offering me "friendly advice," regarding the possibility of legal action being taken against me, but I'm quite sure his post was a thinly-veiled threat. I think most people who have read my posts and blog entries know I am intelligent enough to be aware that I am accountable for my own words. In addition, I have publicly stated, many times, that I am willing to stand behind my words, in a court of law. When the moderator reminded everyone he was not going to tolerate threats of legal action, FD and Mathew Sullivan, (of Suspended Animation), threw childish temper-tantrums, maintaining that what FD had offered up was intended to be "friendly advice." Personally, I found that to be insulting to my intelligence, and I think the moderator did, too
. I believe anyone who has followed the discussions on CF, should be able to see through, what I consider to have been, a charade designed to intimidate me.
Then, the moderator indicated HE had received threats of litigation, if he did not "remove certain posts," which I can only assume to be mine. Amazingly, Charles Platt then showed up with a post, which made it appear he was one of the people, who had been threatening the CF moderator. http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1282961985/Having+it+Both+Ways I believe Mr. Platt has been asking the moderator to step on my right to "free speech." That's funny, because I thought Mr. Platt was a proponent of free speech. Unlike certain other people, who occasionally post on the Cold Filter cryonics forum, I'm not prone to doling out false information in attempts to discredit someone, and I am careful to only state facts and opinions which I feel I can support, and which I believe I am entitl
ed to express. I don't see how anyone could even pretend there was something legally actionable, in this post: http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1282654706/Why+Pay+Alcor+Membersh
ip+Dues-
Why are three people, who are not employed by Alcor, (as far as I know), responding to my post about Alcor's membership dues, with implied threats of litigation, directed at not only me, but the moderator of a cryonics-related forum? I don't believe any of their names were mentioned in my post. Isn't Alcor capable of responding to criticisms of their organization, if they so desire? Don't they have a number of attorneys currently representing them, in at least three states? I think Alcor members should be concerned that, in response to criticisms of the self-proclaimed "pioneer" of cryopreservation, the only reaction comes from three persons outside that organization, (one of them anonymous, and one of them having already had to hire an attorney, who advised him to correct and apologize fo
r false statements, which had been made about me!).
Read more, here, and form your own opinion: http://cryomedical.blogspot.com/2010/08/interesting-events-on-cold-filter.html
Note: I actually wrote this post a couple of days ago, but somehow both of my email addresses had been unsubscribed. (I have no idea what went wrong, but thanks to Kevin for resolving the problem, and for maintaining Cryonet.)
Melody Maxim
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Message #32803
From: "John de Rivaz" <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry...
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2010 23:17:31 +0100
The world's first car appeared around 1800. A replica built a few years ago
was virtually impossible to control, so articles could have appeared for
nearly 100 years suggesting that "horseless carriages" were an idea that
would never bear fruit.
http://www.h2-hydro-gen.com/page19.html
Steam engines appeared two millenia ago - Hero's Engine. Philosophers no
doubt made similar remarks about their lack of torque and therefore
practicability. As far as I know no one tried to make a car using one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero_of_Alexandria
Electricity has been known from antiquity, and considered useless for
thousands of years. Only relatively recently (in terms of millenia) has it
become so useful. Until it became useful, similar remarks would have been
made.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity
The legend of Aladdin's Lamp has been regarded as a fable for millenia. Now
there is one in almost every home. (A computer screen is the lamp, rubbing
it is typing on the keyboard, and the wishes limit is the credit card
limit.)
Guess what, the Internet uses electricty (electric current rather than
static electricity) much of which is generated by steam turbines (of
different design to Hero's), and goods bought on eBay are brought to your
door by "horseless carriages" (still powered by a series of explosions, but
not from hydrogen gas).
--
Sincerely, John de Rivaz: http://John.deRivaz.com for websites including
Cryonics Europe, Longevity Report, The Venturists, Porthtowan, Alec Harley
Reeves - inventor, Arthur Bowker - potter, de Rivaz genealogy, Nomad .. and
more
----- Original Message -----
From: MARK PLUS
To: [email protected] ; [email protected]
Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 3:41 PM
Subject: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry"
As I've suspected, cryonics organizations might have made an error a
generation ago by identifying revival scenarios too closely to certain
technological speculations which haven't born fruit:
http://scottlocklin.wordpress.com/2010/08/24/nano-nonsense-25-years-of-charlatanry/
--
Mark Plus
Life is short: Freeze hard!
Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=32803
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Message #32804
From: "John de Rivaz" <[email protected]>
Subject: Fw: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry...
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 09:33:34 +0100
[Mark Plus' message below to Longevity Report was held up by the Yahoo moderation process]
The comment below is surely a feature of exponential growth. da Vinci was writing about planes with little hope of making one with the materials and knowledge of his time. PCM (or analogue to digital conversion) was conceived [1938] more than 25 years before technology made it possible to implement cheaply. Now virtually everything we take for granted would not be possible without it.
Shouting at nanotechnologists won't make programmable assemblers appear any quicker. Evolution made molecular scale assemblers appear, so they exist. The problem of how to make them, and how to make them do our bidding, remains to be solved.
I note the header on
http://lachlan.bluehaze.com.au/nanoshite/
>>>
Lachlan passed away in January 2010. As a memorial, this site remains as he left it.
Therefore the information on this site may not be current or accurate and should not be relied upon.
<<<
... without the benefit of cryopreservation, no doubt.
--
Sincerely, John de Rivaz: http://John.deRivaz.com for websites including
Cryonics Europe, Longevity Report, The Venturists, Porthtowan, Alec Harley
Reeves - inventor, Arthur Bowker - potter, de Rivaz genealogy, Nomad .. and
more
----- Original Message -----
From: MARK PLUS
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 11:34 PM
Subject: Re: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry...
Scott Locklin in the comments to his blog post points out:
>Charles Babbage designed something which could have been made with the technology of the time. If Britain had dedicated a significant portion of its GDP and thousands of workers to creating an analytical engine for the next 25 years, and failed to even build a gear for the damn thing, well, then we might have suspected that Mr. Babbage was full of baked beans. 25 years! Do you know how long 25 years is? In 25 years, we went from Von Neumann writing a paper on how to make a digital computer to having freaking Unix and GUI's. In 25 years, we went from biplanes made out of cloth to the SR-71. 25 years is a working lifetime for many people. And there have been hundreds or thousands of people who have dedicated their lives to this "nano idiocy. Yet, we are not one whit closer to having anythi
ng remotely resembling a nanotechnology now than we were 25 years ago. If Drexler and his propellor heads wish to comfort themselves with the idea that they are visionaries ahead of their ti
me; well, I deny it. I maintain that they have picked a delivery date so far into the future that the day of judgement will never come. They'll all be comfortably retired by then. How convenient.
--
Mark Plus
Life is short: Freeze hard!
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