Re: F# fsharp

On Jun 8, 2010, at 2:12 PM, Brandon Van Every wrote:

> On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 2:59 PM, Mickael Pointier <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 
>>>> If you want game scripting, go with whatever fits your particular needs
>>>> --
>>>> which most of the time doesn't include having to include a JavaScript
>>>> runtime (V8, SpiderMonkey, etc), or a CLR runtime (Mono, Microsoft .NET).
>>>> But sometimes it does, I guess.
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> This is more about how long any given game developer insists on using
>>> C++.  If a garbage collected virtual machine is already in use and
>>> deemed acceptable, then things like F# or Clojure are not much of a
>>> leap.
>>> 
>> 
>> Some people are developing on systems where C++ (or Java) is the only
>> possible choice, but if you can make sure that Sony, Nintendo, Apple, and
>> the gazillion of mobile systems around there accept F#, sure more people
>> will use it.
> 
> My biases: I think PCs are a better deal for indie development than
> consoles, I hate the small screens + underpowered 3D of mobile
> devices, and I hate the web.  So Windows-only F# development becomes

The question, as always, is about development costs and distribution opportunities.  The web is popular precisely because of the distribution opportunities it opens up.  The lowered expectations of the casual gaming market(s) work to address the development cost component.

The reason I chose Unity3D when I started my venture was so that I could have the option of Mac, Windows, AND web -- not be forced into an either/or choice.  While uptake of their browser plugin isn't nearly good enough that a Unity-based game has a realistic chance of becoming the next SocialCity or FarmVille or Mafia Wars (the social gaming marketplace is one where a 10-15% increase in friction is enough to kill your shot at viral growth), there are still niches where its viable and the plugin seems to have some serious momentum.  Witness the Tiger Woods PGA Tour game on Facebook.


> acceptable to me.  I like the potential of F# to make money on
> non-game gigs, to fund my indie habit.  I don't imagine that any big
> game studio is going to move away from C++ anytime soon, as they will
> be shackled by the need to release on multiple consoles.  I will look

Tiger Woods PGA Tour Online, distributed on Facebook as well as via EA.com:  Built with Unity3D, presumably in C# (as Unity Webplayers don't allow native code usage), or at least some other .Net language.

http://apps.facebook.com/tigerwoodsonline

EA's Richard Hilleman did a keynote at Unite 2009 (Unity tradeshow)

http://unity3d.com/support/resources/unite-presentations/keynote-presentation-unite-09

And Phil Harrison of Atari did a guest keynote at Unite 2008.


> into Clojure when someone proves it's worth real money.  Right now, it
> looks like some guy doing Yet Another Language without any serious
> industrial support.

I've always found it handy to look at new languages and frameworks to inform my thoughts on development in general even if the particular tool(s) aren't going to be directly useful to me.  At my day job, I've written both PHP and ASP.Net code that's heavily influenced by ideas I picked up from having used Ruby on Rails.  The end result has proven to be slimmer, clearer, more maintainable code.

That said, we all have a finite amount of time and it's always a gamble as to whether or not a language will offer you an understanding you don't already have...

-JF

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