[ippm] Soliciting comments on draft-ye-ippm-switching-efficien cy

Weiqiang Sun <[email protected]> Sun, 26 Jul 2026 10:54:24 +0800
Newsgroups gmane.ietf.ippm,gmane.ietf.bmwg
Message-ID <[email protected]>
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Hello IPPM/BMWG!

This is a much belated solicitation for comments on =
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ye-ippm-switching-efficiency/. =
The draft was uploaded in April and presented on IETF 126 in Viena.

The questions we ask is: when ASICs with different capacities (radix =
times port capacity) are deployed in AI fabrics following different =
design philosophies, i.e., fabric architectures (spine/leaf, dragonfly, =
or 3d-torus), are they efficiently utilized? Are there spaces to make =
the AI fabric leaner and greener? Switching efficiency, which we shall =
now call Fabric Switching Efficiency =E2=80=93 FSE,  measures =
computationally effective data throughput (analogous to algorithmic =
bandwidth) per unit of deployed switching capacity.  FSE characterizes =
how the AI fabric design (topology, routing and use of =
in-network-computing) fit the tasks run on the fabric. One interesting =
analogy, which I should borrow from one expert I talked to these days, =
is PUE (Power Usage Effectiveness). PUE is a high level metric. It does =
not take into account the complexity of the operations inside the DCs, =
but it effectively captures whether energy/power is efficiently used for =
compute in DCs. With FSE, we aim to provide a measure that can be easily =
understood and communicated just like PUE. One interesting feature of =
FSE is that it can be very naturally decomposed into 3 finer granular =
metrics: data efficiency, port utilization and routing efficiency, each =
capturing one specific AI fabric design target. FSE can be used at least =
by two groups of people: 1) AIDC network architects who would like to =
improve the fabric design. 2) anyone who likes to operate a leaner / =
greener AIDC network.=20

We are aware that the set of AI fabric benchmarking documents are =
already pretty complete with well defined scope/terminology, and =
methodologies (for inference and training). The documents provides =
performance metrics (end to end) for AI fabrics from the eyes of model =
users who runs inference or training jobs.  FSE operates at higher =
levels. We don=E2=80=99t intend to provide performance metrics to be =
used by LLM model developer/deployment people.=20

The natural next step is to turn this concept into methodologies that =
IPPMers/BMWGers/BPMers are interested in and would be willing to =
contribute to. We will  be happy to receive any feedbacks and work with =
the community to move this work forward.

For folks who are interested, please also read our paper on arXiv - =
arXiv:2604.14690 (https://arxiv.org/abs/2604.14690), in which the =
rationale and numerical results are discussed in much more detail. We =
are still improving this paper by adding more packet level simulations =
to reveal how the metrics behave when different compute / communication =
kernels are executed and different routing schemes are applied.



Much thanks,

Weiqiang



--
Weiqiang Sun
Professor, Shanghai Jiao Tong University
Mobile: +86-13801847900
Email: [email protected]
Addr: Room 5-513, SEIEE Building, Shanghai Jiao Tong University, =
Minhang, Shanghai, 200240, China


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<html aria-label=3D"message body"><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" =
content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body =
style=3D"overflow-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
line-break: after-white-space;"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><font =
face=3D"Calibri" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">Hello =
IPPM/BMWG!<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><font =
face=3D"Calibri" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">This is a much belated =
solicitation for comments on&nbsp;<a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ye-ippm-switching-efficienc=
y/" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114);">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ye-ippm-switching-efficiency=
/</a>. The draft was uploaded in April and presented on IETF 126 in =
Viena.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><font =
face=3D"Calibri"><span style=3D"font-size: 14px;">The questions we ask =
is: when ASICs with different capacities (radix times port capacity) are =
deployed in AI fabrics following different design philosophies, i.e., =
fabric architectures (spine/leaf, dragonfly, or 3d-torus), are they =
efficiently utilized? Are there spaces to make the AI fabric leaner and =
greener? Switching efficiency,&nbsp;</span></font><span =
style=3D"font-family: Calibri; font-size: 14px;">which we shall now call =
Fabric Switching Efficiency =E2=80=93 FSE, &nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri;">measures =
computationally effective data throughput (analogous to algorithmic =
bandwidth) per unit of deployed switching capacity.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri;">&nbsp; FSE =
characterizes how the AI fabric design (topology, routing and use of =
in-network-computing) fit the tasks run on the fabric. One interesting =
analogy, which I should borrow from one expert I talked to these days, =
is PUE (Power Usage Effectiveness). PUE is a high level metric. It does =
not take into account the complexity of the operations inside the DCs, =
but it effectively captures whether energy/power is efficiently used for =
compute in DCs. With FSE, we aim to provide a measure that can be easily =
understood and communicated just like PUE. One interesting feature of =
FSE is that it can be very naturally decomposed into 3 finer granular =
metrics: data efficiency, port utilization and routing efficiency, each =
capturing one specific AI fabric design target. FSE can be used at least =
by two groups of people: 1) AIDC network architects who would like to =
improve the fabric design. 2) anyone who likes&nbsp;to operate a leaner =
/ greener AIDC network.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 14px; =
font-family: Calibri;">&nbsp;</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: =
justify;"><font face=3D"Calibri" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">We are aware =
that the set of AI fabric benchmarking documents are already pretty =
complete with well defined scope/terminology, and methodologies (for =
inference and training). The documents provides performance metrics (end =
to end) for AI fabrics from the eyes of model users who runs inference =
or training jobs.&nbsp;&nbsp;FSE operates at higher levels. We don=E2=80=99=
t intend to provide performance metrics to be used by LLM model =
developer/deployment people.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; =
text-align: justify;"><font face=3D"Calibri" style=3D"font-size: =
14px;">The natural next step is to turn this concept into methodologies =
that IPPMers/BMWGers/BPMers are interested in and would be willing to =
contribute to. We will&nbsp;&nbsp;be happy to receive any feedbacks and =
work with the community to move this work =
forward.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><font =
face=3D"Calibri" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">For folks who are =
interested, please also read our paper on arXiv - arXiv:2604.14690 (<a =
href=3D"https://arxiv.org/abs/2604.14690" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114);">https://arxiv.org/abs/2604.14690</a>), in which the rationale and =
numerical results are discussed in much more detail. We are still =
improving this paper by adding more packet level simulations to reveal =
how the metrics behave when different compute / communication kernels =
are executed and different routing schemes are =
applied.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri;"><br></span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: =
Calibri;">Much thanks,</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; text-align: justify;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri;">Weiqiang</span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 8pt; line-height: 18.4px; =
text-align: justify;"><br></p><div>--</div><div>Weiqiang =
Sun</div><div>Professor, Shanghai Jiao Tong University</div><div>Mobile: =
+86-13801847900</div><div>Email: [email protected]</div><div>Addr: Room =
5-513, SEIEE Building, Shanghai Jiao Tong University, Minhang, Shanghai, =
200240, China</div>
<br></body></html>=

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