Re: Comments on Composition and Comportment of the IETF Nominating Committee draft
<[email protected]> Mon, 27 Jul 2026 10:27:24 +0000 (UTC)
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.general |
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------=_Part_3674729_600727937.1785148044775 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable hi=C2=A0Pete, I=C2=A0commented during=C2=A0the tenure of that chair previously,and my vie= w of actions=C2=A0then=C2=A0being=C2=A0taken was somewhatdismal. https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/j0KGyHu-BPia_XpZ8U9uHlBDTIU/ It can be argued that there is nothing that be concluded-statistically- fro= m=C2=A0a single sample.=C2=A0But a lot can be concludedfrom what a chair pu= shes for, and disagreeing with eitherwhat is being pushed for,=C2=A0or how = it is being pushed for,=C2=A0isentirely reasonable to do. Insulting? no. It= 's a pushbackagainst=C2=A0promoted=C2=A0policy, and is itself political in = nature. I note that the TERM workgroup was not created to policelanguage,=C2=A0and = that we do=C2=A0still have mailing lists. (Although much discussion now=C2=A0happens privately in focusedgithub=C2=A0= spaces when it should imo=C2=A0be more visible=C2=A0to a broaderaudience=C2= =A0on lists - I'm not attributing any=C2=A0lack of action on that toany par= ticular=C2=A0chair, but a study group on what github is doing toietf discus= sions across disparate workgroups might be a goodidea, if it hasn't been do= ne already.) best Lloyd [email protected] putting=C2=A0decent leaders in leadership roles is nomcom's job.where shoul= d=C2=A0specifying=C2=A0gender come into it? On 27 Jul 2026, at 19:14, Pete Resnick <[email protected]= .org> wrote: =EF=BB=BFOn 27 Jul 2026, at 6:19, [email protected] wrote: Mallory said: We need to work on making the IETF as a whole more welcoming to as wide a range of people as practical. I know it's possible because I've seen it happen at M3AAWG and (for all its faults) ICANN, both of which have way more women in leadership roles than we do. Mallory, having a female chair of the IETF... wasn't a great experience. Still, there's arguably little concrete to conclude from that single sample point. So let me understand: You decided to insult a particular individual, the on= ly female chair of the IETF, to make a point? But you also say that there's= next to nothing you can conclude from that single sample point? So, we're = to conclude that you decided to insult that person for the sake of insultin= g them, right? And yet we wonder why it's so difficult to even have these d= iscussions in this organization, let alone make a change, on these topics. Thanking the deities I no longer have any hats of relevance, pr --=20 Pete Resnick https://www.episteme.net/ All connections to the world are tenuous at best ------=_Part_3674729_600727937.1785148044775 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microso= ft-com:vml" xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><head><!--[= if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:PixelsPerInch>= 96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]--></head><bo= dy> <div id=3D"yiv6554801416">hi Pete,<div><br></div><div><br></div><div>I= commented during the tenure of that chair previously,</div><div>= and my view of actions then being taken was somewhat</div><d= iv>dismal.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><a rel=3D"nofollow noope= ner noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch= /msg/ietf/j0KGyHu-BPia_XpZ8U9uHlBDTIU/">https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/m= sg/ietf/j0KGyHu-BPia_XpZ8U9uHlBDTIU/</a><br id=3D"yiv6554801416lineBreakAtB= eginningOfSignature"><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr= "><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></d= iv><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-= webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">It can be argued that there is nothing that= be concluded</span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir= =3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">-statistically- fr= om a single sample. But a lot can be concluded</span></div><div i= d=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-webkit-te= xt-size-adjust: auto;">from what a chair pushes for, and disagreeing with e= ither</span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><= span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">what is being pushed for,&nb= sp;or how it is being pushed for, is</span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801= 416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust:= auto;">entirely reasonable to do. Insulting? no. It's a pushback</span></d= iv><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-= webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">against promoted policy, and is i= tself political in nature.</span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSig= nature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" d= ir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr= ">I note that the TERM workgroup was not created to police</div><div id=3D"= yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">language,<span style=3D"-webki= t-text-size-adjust: auto;"> and that we do </span><span style=3D"= -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">still have mailing lists.</span></div><div= id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yi= v6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv65548014= 16AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">(Although much discussion now happen= s privately in focused</div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir= =3D"ltr">github <span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">spaces= when it should imo </span><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: au= to;">be more visible</span><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">= to a </span><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">broader</= span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span st= yle=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">audience </span><span style=3D= "-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">on lists - I'm not attributing any l= ack of action on that to</span></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSigna= ture" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">any parti= cular </span><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">chair, bu= t a study group on what github is doing to</span></div><div id=3D"yiv655480= 1416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust= : auto;">ietf discussions across disparate workgroups might be a good</span= ></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><span style= =3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">idea, if it hasn't been done already.<= /span><span style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">)</span></div><div id= =3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv65= 54801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416A= ppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">best</div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailS= ignature" dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature"= dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div id=3D"yiv6554801416AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"l= tr">Lloyd Wood <div>[email protected]</div><div><br></d= iv><div><br></div><div>putting decent leaders in leadership roles is n= omcom's job.</div><div>where should specifying gender come into i= t?</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquot= e type=3D"cite">On 27 Jul 2026, at 19:14, Pete Resnick <resnick=3D40epis= [email protected]> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote ty= pe=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<span>On 27 Jul 2026, at 6:19, lloydw= [email protected] wrote:</span><br><span></span><br><blockquote typ= e=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Mallory said:</span><br></blockq= uote></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span= >We need to work on making the IETF as a whole more welcoming</span><br></b= lockquote></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite">= <span>to as wide a range of people as practical. I know it's possible</span= ><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type= =3D"cite"><span>because I've seen it happen at M3AAWG and (for all its faul= ts)</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquo= te type=3D"cite"><span>ICANN, both of which have way more women in leadersh= ip roles than we do.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type= =3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Mal= lory, having a female chair of the IETF... wasn't a great experience.</span= ><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Still, there's arguably l= ittle concrete to conclude from that single</span><br></blockquote><blockqu= ote type=3D"cite"><span>sample point.</span><br></blockquote><span></span><= br><span>So let me understand: You decided to insult a particular individua= l, the only female chair of the IETF, to make a point? But you also say tha= t there's next to nothing you can conclude from that single sample point? S= o, we're to conclude that you decided to insult that person for the sake of= insulting them, right? And yet we wonder why it's so difficult to even hav= e these discussions in this organization, let alone make a change, on these= topics.</span><br><span></span><br><span>Thanking the deities I no longer = have any hats of relevance,</span><br><span></span><br><span>pr</span><br><= span>-- </span><br><span>Pete Resnick https://www.episteme.net/</span><br><= span>All connections to the world are tenuous at best</span><br></div></blo= ckquote></div></div> </body></html> ------=_Part_3674729_600727937.1785148044775--