Re: timing for venue contracting

Hi Jordi

First, let me apologise again for how late this booking was.  It should =
not have come so late and every effort will be made to ensure that we =
are not this late again.

Unfortunately your suggestions grossly underestimate the work required.  =
We could not with "a lot of extra workload for a few months" contract =
4-5 years out, not even close.  Each venue takes between 12-36 months of =
negotiations before we get to a contract.  Many refuse to even open =
negotiations until we have visited them in person to prove we are =
genuinely interested.  In the case of Kuala Lumpur we went to the =
community for feedback in May 2023,  did the site visit in October 2023 =
and have been in negotiations since.  This is with one person working =
full time on just the negotiation side with three on the meeting =
planning side and assisted by our lawyers. =20

As to why we don=E2=80=99t go back to the same venues more often, this =
is generally for three reasons:

1.  They are booked.  This, for example, is why we have not been back to =
Minneapolis in many years.

2.  They increase their prices considerably.  This is why we have not =
been back to Singapore as their price rose by ~50%.

3. Every country prevents entry (either directly or indirectly) to a =
certain set of people.  If we return to the same country too often then =
that same group of people is regularly unable to participate onsite.

While I understand the difficulties you face when we announce a venue =
with less than a year=E2=80=99s notice, at times that cannot be avoided.

Jay

> On 23 Jul 2026, at 20:55, [email protected] wrote:
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> Hi Jay,
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> I wanted to raise this point in the plenary yesterday, but I had to =
leave a bit earlier.
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> If I recall correctly, this is the 2nd time in the last few years =
(Brisbane was the other one), that a venue is announced extremely late.
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> May be this is not being realized, but it creates for some =
participants that pay traveling from their own pocket a very high =
penalty even inability to actually make it. Yes, they can still =
participate remotely, but we all know is not the same. On-site =
conversations, not just the WG meetings are very important, in addition =
to the difference of being in the same time zone for the meeting itself.
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> I=E2=80=99m not sure how many people can/prefers planning ahead, but =
I=E2=80=99m sure others can take advantage of that, and doing so =
doesn=E2=80=99t create any trouble for the rest of the participants. In =
my own case, the difference is quite significative. If I get my flights =
11-12 months in advance, I can use my miles and just pay 250 euros or so =
(just taxes) to travel to KL. An alternative is to pay around 1.000 =
euros and get upgraded for free (because my status in the airline), or =
using my miles as well. Instead now, as checked yesterday, it will cost =
me over 5.000 euros for the same trip/cabin (seats or upgrades with =
miles aren=E2=80=99t anymore available).
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> I fully understand that many participants are funded by their =
employers, and may be the employers don=E2=80=99t care too much (or not =
at all) about that, but I=E2=80=99m sure I=E2=80=99m not alone with this =
and it doesn=E2=80=99t make any sense that even if is a small set of =
people being affected, not being considerate to them.
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> If I understood correctly, from you yesterday in the plenary, now you =
start working on contracts for meetings after 2027. I really don=E2=80=99t=
 understand the need to hold that, and instead, considering that our =
meeting dates are set for at least 6-7 years in advance, work already in =
all the possible venues for the next 5 years in advance, contract and =
announce them at least 1-2 years in advance, but *never* later than 1 =
year in advance.
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> This will also give us the advantage, that in case of any venue =
failure (I recall we had that happening at some point in Canada some =
years ago), we have more time to react, possibly even with several =
options. Just consider if for whatever reason KL was not fixed a few =
days ago and time passes and we don=E2=80=99t have suitable alternatives =
or we need to pay much more for one of them. I don=E2=80=99t think we =
can take that risk.
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> I understand that doing this now means a lot of extra workload for a =
few months, but after that, when you have already contracted 4-5 years, =
you only need to take care of the 6th following year, and so on. I also =
understand that this may look difficult for new venues because the time =
required for on-site surveys, but there is a simple solution for that: =
for the next 3-4 years, just consider venues that we already had used =
before (we have several of them in every region, so not a problem).
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> In fact, I=E2=80=99ve been very surprised when I=E2=80=99ve asked in =
the last 3 meetings, if we are coming back to Madrid and if is already =
fixed, and the answer was NO, first possible slot is summer 2030. How =
come, if we know the participants were so happy (according to the survey =
and all conversations we had), we have not even started to talk with the =
venue again. Why we don=E2=80=99t start working with the venue =
immediately and fix it in a few months, even if it is 4 years in =
advance?
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> It doesn=E2=80=99t make any sense to me. I could only imagine, that if =
you try to negotiate with the hotel now for 2030 they will give you a =
higher price (I don=E2=80=99t think so, I actually think it will be =
lower, and you reduce the risk of not being available on our preferred =
dates by fixing it now, or even it can be negotiated with a price =
difference considering life cost increase, etc.). However, if this is =
the issue, you are moving the price difference to the traveling cost of =
the participants (in additional to other planing they may wish to do, =
such vacations or business side-by-side the meeting).
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> I used Madrid as a clear example, but of course, the same can be done, =
at least for the next 4-5 years, with venues that have been very well =
rated, as I think it was Berlin, BKK, Singapore, etc., and that may keep =
offering sufficiently good conditions for IETF.
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> Regards,
> Jordi
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> @jordipalet
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>> El 21 jul 2026, a las 15:07, IETF Executive Director =
<[email protected]> escribi=C3=B3:
>>=20
>> The IETF Administration LLC is pleased to announce Kuala Lumpur as =
the location for the IETF 128 meeting, scheduled for 6-12 March 2027.
>>=20
>> The support and commitment of our Global Hosts and meeting sponsors =
ensures that IETF participants can meet and collaborate in the highly =
productive environment of an onsite meeting. To find out more about =
these opportunities to support the IETF, please see:
>>=20
>> https://www.ietf.org/support-us/sponsorship/
>>=20
>> I look forward to seeing many of you there.
>>=20
>> --=20
>> Jay Daley
>> IETF Executive Director
>> [email protected]
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
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--=20
Jay Daley
[email protected]
www.ietf.org