Re: Adding GPS location to IPv6 header
"Fred Baker (fred)" <[email protected]> Fri, 16 Nov 2012 03:05:11 +0000
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.ipv6,gmane.ietf.geopriv |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
--===============0654840042575865239== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_8C48B86A895913448548E6D15DA7553B1B92F4xmbrcdx09ciscocom_" --_000_8C48B86A895913448548E6D15DA7553B1B92F4xmbrcdx09ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You may certainly file an internet draft with your ideas. You will want to = read about what an Internet Draft is and how to file one. http://www.ietf.o= rg/id-info/ Filing an Internet Draft does not imply consensus around the specification,= and you will need to build that consensus. You will want to make your case= , and I would suggest starting on the geopriv mailing list, although the ca= se will eventually have to be made to 6man. http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/= geopriv/charter/. One consideration you should take in view is that the IPv6 header is not en= crypted, so information found in it is globally readable. If there is ever = a case in which your GPS location is needed by the application but may need= to be guarded for privacy reasons, you will want to put it in the applicat= ion layer (above the transport, guarded by IPsec or TLS), not the network l= ayer. In fact, I would expect that 6man might tell you that the IPv6 header= has one primary purpose, which is to conduct a datagram from the sender's = system to the intended receiver's system; if the data doesn't help achieve = that, it's probably in the wrong header. On Nov 10, 2012, at 7:05 AM, Ammar Salih wrote: Hello IETF, based on my discussions with both ipv6 and geopriv teams, I=92v= e written the below document to summarize few ideas. Is it possible to publish this on IETF website? even if it will not be impl= emented now, at least for documentation and requesting feedback from the co= mmunity. Many thanks. Ammar Ammar J. Salih Baghdad, Iraq October 30, 2012 Title: IP-LOC Adding GPS location to IPv6 header Abstract: =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D This document describes IP-LOC, an extension to IPv6 header which sugges= ts adding GPS coordinates, as the current method of determining the locatio= n of IP traffic is through IP address registration database, which is not v= ery accurate as it depends on how the ISP registers its IP subnets, that is= normally done in a country/city format. It also assumes that in the future, GPS capability will be added to the rou= ter itself (just like smart phones) and packet marking and classification b= ased on geo-location will be required. QoS, firewall and routing based on geo-location will be highly required whe= n mobile routers move from one geo-location to another which has different = policy. Benefits of adding GPS location to IPv6 header (IP-LOC) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Web Services: getting more accurate locations will enhance many services pr= ovided by the web, like targeted commercials (for example, I can get Ads re= garding restaurants available in my neighborhoods instead of all restaurant= s in the city), another good example would be webpage=92s language, my lang= uage will be detected more accurately based on my area rather than my count= ry, as there are many countries with more than one popular language, not me= ntioning that many ip registrations does not even reflect the traffic origi= nating country. ------------------------------- Information accuracy and control: Nowadays, locations are assigned to IP ad= dresses without user awareness or control, every time a user performs ip-lo= okup query the response would be different based on how the ISP has registe= red this IP subnet, IP-LOC suggests making locations more accurate and cont= rollable through OS and network devices, exactly like IP addresses (user ca= n change his/her IP address, but router can also modify the header informat= ion - in case it's required). ------------------------------- Routing: Policy based routing, based on geo-location, like routing predefin= ed traffic through certain server or path, for different purposes (security= , manageability, serviceability like choosing language, or routing traffic = to specific cashing or proxy server based on country .. etc) ------------------------------- Copyright law: It happens when certain media/web content is not allowed in = certain countries due to copyright law, the current method of determining l= ocations is not accurate at all, on other hand, If layer-7 application to b= e used then the user might be able to manipulate the location field, in thi= s case (if it=92s required in future) the ISP can tag traffic with country/= city more accurately as traffic passes through ISP=92s boarder routers. ------------------------------- Maps, navigation, emergency calls and many other services will be also enha= nced with accurate locations. CURRENT ARGUMENTS AGAINST THIS IDEA: =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =93Adding GPS position to every IPv6 header would add a lot of overhead=94 Response: It does not have to be in every IPv6 header, only when there is l= ocation update, also the host should have the option of not to send locatio= n updates. ------------------------------- =93What about privacy?=94 Response: User should have the option of not sending location updates. User= should also have the ability to set location to all zeros, in this case no= router will modify the location field and user loses the location-based se= rvices. If it=92s router-to-router link, then no need to be worried about privacy a= s such information usually configured on a separate network. -------------------------------- =93a good alternative would be to create application layer protocols that c= ould request and send GPS positions=94 Response: the layer-7 location request will not be detected by layer-3 devi= ces (Routers), I am assuming that in the future, GPS capability will be add= ed to the router itself (just like smart phones), features like packet mark= ing and classification based on geo-location will be required to enforce th= e new geo-location policies. -------------------------------- =93For location-based routing protocols: Why would you want this? Geograph= ical location isn't actually that important a metric for routing; what you = care about there is *topological* location, how far I am away from you in t= erms of hops or latency=94 Response: For shortest path maybe yes, hops or latency is important, not fo= r policy-based routing, in our case you might want to do location-based rou= ting, like, routing traffic coming from French speaking users (in multi-lan= guage country like Canada) to google.fr<http://google.fr/> --------------------------------- =93For geolocation-based ACLs: you have the problem that if the geolocation= is attached by the endpoint, then it can't be trusted, since the endpoint = would lie to get past the ACL. If it's attached by a router, the ACL needs= to have proof that the router attached it (and not the endpoint), which me= ans that you would need a signed geolocation header=94 Response: You could have the router modify the location field anyways, just= like L3 QoS fields, if you don't trust the host, so no need for encryption= or security, additionally, ACL is not only for security, it could be used= for routing, QoS ..etc, so the host will not always has the motivation to = manipulate the location field. --------------------------------- =93Why can=92t you simply implement rules related to geo-locations statical= ly on the network device (router, firewall .. etc)?=94 Response: To enforce new geo-location policies automatically, let=92s assum= e that a mobile router (like a mobile BTS in a GSM network) moved from city= -x to city-y, and according to city-x regulations VoIP calls over GSM netwo= rk is allowed, but city-y regulations do not allow that. Now the topology m= ay reflect same network metrics in both cities but there is no rule that tr= iggers configuration change based on geo-location. --------------------------------- What do you think? Author/Contact Information: Ammar J. Salih Baghdad, Iraq Phone: +964 770 533 0306 Email: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> -------------------------------------------------------------------- IETF IPv6 working group mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------- The ignorance of how to use new knowledge stockpiles exponentially. - Marshall McLuhan --_000_8C48B86A895913448548E6D15DA7553B1B92F4xmbrcdx09ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html> <head> <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1= 252"> </head> <body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-lin= e-break: after-white-space; "> You may certainly file an internet draft with your ideas. You will want to = read about what an Internet Draft is and how to file one. <a href=3D"h= ttp://www.ietf.org/id-info/">http://www.ietf.org/id-info/</a> <div><br> </div> <div>Filing an Internet Draft does not imply consensus around the specifica= tion, and you will need to build that consensus. You will want to make your= case, and I would suggest starting on the geopriv mailing list, although t= he case will eventually have to be made to 6man. <a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/geopriv/ch= arter/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/geopriv/charter/</a>. </div> <div><br> </div> <div>One consideration you should take in view is that the IPv6 header is n= ot encrypted, so information found in it is globally readable. If ther= e is ever a case in which your GPS location is needed by the application bu= t may need to be guarded for privacy reasons, you will want to put it in the application layer (above the trans= port, guarded by IPsec or TLS), not the network layer. In fact, I would exp= ect that 6man might tell you that the IPv6 header has one primary purpose, = which is to conduct a datagram from the sender's system to the intended receiver's system; if the data doesn't= help achieve that, it's probably in the wrong header.</div> <div> <div><br> <div> <div>On Nov 10, 2012, at 7:05 AM, Ammar Salih wrote:</div> <br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-= collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-varian= t: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal= ; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: n= one; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-hori= zontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-dec= orations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stro= ke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "> <div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"> <div class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: WordSection1; "> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">H= ello IETF, based on my discussions with both ipv6 and geopriv teams, I=92ve= written the below document to summarize few ideas.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I= s it possible to publish this on IETF website? even if it will not be imple= mented now, at least for documentation and requesting feedback from the com= munity.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><= o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">M= any thanks.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">A= mmar<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Ammar J. Sali= h<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Baghdad, Iraq= <o:p></o:p></sp= an></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">October 30, 2= 012<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Title: IP-LOC= <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = &nb= sp; <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; text-align: center; "> <b><span style=3D"font-size: 14pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Adding GPS= location to IPv6 header<o:p></o:p></span></b></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; text-align: center; "> <b><span style=3D"font-size: 14pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> = ;</o:p></span></b></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Abstract:<o:p= ></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = This document describes IP-LOC, an extension to IPv6 header which suggests = adding GPS coordinates, as the current method of determining the location o= f IP traffic is through IP address registration database, which is not very accurate as it depends on how the ISP register= s its IP subnets, that is normally done in a country/city format.<o:p></o:p= ></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">It also assum= es that in the future, GPS capability will be added to the router itself (j= ust like smart phones) and packet marking and classification based on geo-l= ocation will be required.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">QoS, firewall= and routing based on geo-location will be highly required when mobile rout= ers move from one geo-location to another which has different policy.<o:p><= /o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Benefits of a= dding GPS location to IPv6 header (IP-LOC)<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; ">Web Services: getting more accurate location= s will enhance many services provided by the web, like targeted commercials= (for example, I can get Ads regarding restaurants available in my neighbor= hoods instead of all restaurants in the city), another good example would be webpage=92s language, my language= will be detected more accurately based on my area rather than my country, = as there are many countries with more than one popular language, not mentio= ning that many ip registrations does not even reflect the traffic originating country.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> -------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; ">Information accuracy and control: Nowadays, = locations are assigned to IP addresses without user awareness or control, e= very time a user performs ip-lookup query the response would be different b= ased on how the ISP has registered this IP subnet, IP-LOC suggests making locations more accurate and control= lable through OS and network devices, exactly like IP addresses (user can c= hange his/her IP address, but router can also modify the header information= - in case it's required).<o:p></o:p></span></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> -------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; "><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; ">Routing: Policy based routing, based on geo-= location, like routing predefined traffic through certain server or path, f= or different purposes (security, manageability, serviceability like choosin= g language, or routing traffic to specific cashing or proxy server based on country .. etc)<o:p></o:p></span= ></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> -------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; "><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"color: black; ">Copyright law: It happens when certain media= /web content is not allowed in certain countries due to copyright law, the = current method of determining locations is not accurate at all, on other ha= nd, If layer-7 application to be used then the user might be able to manipulate the location field, in this case= (if it=92s required in future) the ISP can tag traffic with country/city m= ore accurately as traffic passes through ISP=92s boarder routers.<o:p></o:p= ></span></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> -------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Maps, navigation, emergency calls and many other services will be also enha= nced with accurate locations.<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> <pre style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">CURRENT AR= GUMENTS AGAINST THIS IDEA:<o:p></o:p></pre> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<o:p></o:p></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93Adding GPS position to every IPv6 header would add a lot of overhead=94<= o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: It does not have to be in every IPv6 header, only when there is l= ocation update, also the host should have the option of not to send locatio= n updates.<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> -------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93What about privacy?=94<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: User should have the option of not sending location updates. User= should also have the ability to set location to all zeros, in this case no= router will modify the location field and user loses the location-based se= rvices.<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> If it=92s router-to-router link, then no need to be worried about privacy a= s such information usually configured on a separate network.<o:p></o:p></di= v> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> --------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93a good alternative would be to create application layer protocols that c= ould request and send GPS positions=94<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: the layer-7 location request will not be detected by layer-3 devi= ces (Routers), I am assuming that in the future, GPS capability will be add= ed to the router itself (just like smart phones), features like packet mark= ing and classification based on geo-location will be required to enforce the new geo-location policies.<o:= p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> --------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93For location-based routing protocols: Why would you want this? Geo= graphical location isn't actually that important a metric for routing; what= you care about there is *topological* location, how far I am away from you= in terms of hops or latency=94<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: For shortest path maybe yes, hops or latency is important, not fo= r policy-based routing, in our case you might want to do location-based rou= ting, like, routing traffic coming from French speaking users (in multi-lan= guage country like Canada) to<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </= span><a href=3D"http://google.fr/" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: u= nderline; ">google.fr</a><o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> ---------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93For geolocation-based ACLs: you have the problem that if the geolocation= is attached by the endpoint, then it can't be trusted, since the endpoint = would lie to get past the ACL. If it's attached by a router, the ACL = needs to have proof that the router attached it (and not the endpoint), which means that you would need a signed geoloc= ation header=94<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: You could have the router modify the location field anyways, just= like L3 QoS fields, if you don't trust the host, so no need for encryption= or security, additionally, ACL is not only for security, it could be= used for routing, QoS ..etc, so the host will not always has the motivation to manipulate the location field.<= o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> ---------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> =93Why can=92t you simply implement rules related to geo-locations statical= ly on the network device (router, firewall .. etc)?=94<o:p></o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> <o:p> </o:p></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> Response: To enforce new geo-location policies automatically, let=92s assum= e that a mobile router (like a mobile BTS in a GSM network) moved from city= -x to city-y, and according to city-x regulations VoIP calls over GSM netwo= rk is allowed, but city-y regulations do not allow that. Now the topology may reflect same network metrics in bo= th cities but there is no rule that triggers configuration change based on = geo-location.<o:p></o:p></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-= bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Consolas; "> ---------------------------------<o:p></o:p></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">What do you t= hink?<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Author/Contac= t Information:<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = Ammar J. Salih<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = Baghdad, Iraq<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><o:p> </= o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = Phone: +964 770 533 0306<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; = margin-left: 0in; line-height: normal; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibr= i, sans-serif; "> <span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "> = Email:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href=3D"mailto:= [email protected]" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: underline; = ">[email protected]</a><o:p></o:p></span></div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-= bottom: 10pt; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 17px; font-size: 11pt; font-fa= mily: Calibri, sans-serif; "> <o:p> </o:p></p> </div> --------------------------------------------------------------------<br> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: und= erline; ">[email protected]</a><br> Administrative Requests:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>= <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6" style=3D"color: blue= ; text-decoration: underline; ">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6<= /a><br> --------------------------------------------------------------------</div> </span></blockquote> </div> <br> <div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; c= olor: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-varian= t: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal= ; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: n= one; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-hori= zontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-dec= orations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stro= ke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "> <div> <div>----------------------------------------------------</div> <div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font= -family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: small; ">The = ;</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(34, 34, 34); f= ont-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: small; "><em s= tyle=3D"font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ">ignorance</em></span><sp= an class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:= arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: small; "> of how to </span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(34= , 34, 34); font-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: sm= all; "><em style=3D"font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ">use new</em>= </span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(34, 34, 34); fo= nt-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: small; "> = knowledge </span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(= 34, 34, 34); font-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-size: = small; "><em style=3D"font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ">stockpiles exponentially</em></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: = rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 12px; font-si= ze: small; ">.</span> </div> <div> - Marshall McLuhan</div> </div> </span></div> <br> </div> </div> </body> </html> --_000_8C48B86A895913448548E6D15DA7553B1B92F4xmbrcdx09ciscocom_-- --===============0654840042575865239== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline -------------------------------------------------------------------- IETF IPv6 working group mailing list [email protected] Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 -------------------------------------------------------------------- --===============0654840042575865239==--