[Int-area] Re: [IPsec] New Version Notification for draf t-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt

Joe Touch <[email protected]> Mon, 3 Aug 2026 19:09:22 -0700
Newsgroups gmane.ietf.int,gmane.ietf.tsvwg,gmane.ietf.ipsec
Message-ID <[email protected]>
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FWIW, IMO reordering and resquencing are synonymous. I would not expect =
readers to track the difference, even if coined as different in this =
document.

I would encourage =E2=80=9Cmisordering=E2=80=9D as a more reliably =
interpreted term for changing the order of packets from their arrival.

Also note: reordering and resequencing both could mean EITHER =E2=80=9Cput=
ting things in the correct order=E2=80=9D or =E2=80=9Cputting things =
back to the order in which they arrived=E2=80=9D (which may not be =
correct).

Delay is added whenever EITHER type of reordering/resequencing occurs - =
or (notably) when misordering occurs in the first place.

Another type of delay that midpoint nodes should not try to correct is =
jitter, i.e., variation in the arrival of a packet stream. Again, any =
attempt to change the arrival pattern necessarily introduces delay - as =
does anything that increases that variation.

I.e., the doc focuses on situations where the endpoint could allow =
packets to arrive out of order, but that=E2=80=99s not the only reason =
to avoid resequencing.

Joe=20

> On Aug 3, 2026, at 4:51=E2=80=AFPM, Greg White =
<[email protected]> wrote:
>=20
> Hi Joe,
> =20
> Thanks for the detailed feedback, this is very helpful. We will try to =
tackle as many of these suggestions as we can in the next version.
> =20
> For clarity, in the draft we defined the terms =E2=80=9Creordering=E2=80=
=9D =3D making packet out of order, =E2=80=9Cresequencing=E2=80=9D =3D =
putting them back in order.  To help avoid confusion, I=E2=80=99ve =
edited your points to align with this terminology - with square brackets =
where I=E2=80=99ve made a change.
> =20
> On your final point that it isn=E2=80=99t clear that this document is =
saying anything different from RFC3819: yes, the two excerpts you quoted =
aren=E2=80=99t markedly different, and Section 1 paragraph 2 =
<https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.html#se=
ction-1-2> indicates that the main issue with RFC3819 isn=E2=80=99t that =
statement, it is the text that follows.  Also, I think we=E2=80=99ll end =
up with more concrete recommendations than what are in the draft =
currently.
> =20
> -Greg
> =20
> =20
> From: Joe Touch <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
> Date: Monday, August 3, 2026 at 8:42=E2=80=AFAM
> To: Greg White <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
> Cc: Internet Area <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>, =
"[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>" <[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>>, "[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>" =
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
> Subject: Re: [IPsec] New Version Notification for =
draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt
> =20
> Hi, all,
> =20
> Although the new and updated information provided in this document =
could be useful, it=E2=80=99s not clear that this document supersedes =
any of the advice provided in RFC 3819.
> =20
> Additionally, it omits key information as to why layer 2 frame =
ordering is maintained in certain protocols.
> =20
> In particular:
> - the abstract describes that [resequencing] =E2=80=9Ccan introduce =
delays that result in net degradation of performance=E2=80=9D. Those =
delays can also be irrelevant, e.g., if no further [resequencing] occurs =
and the receiver [resequences] anyway (as with TCP). The lack of such =
[resequencing] can also increase work at the receiver, as when TCP sends =
SACK rather than cumulative ACK. I.e., the impact is not always clear.
> =20
> - on-path interpretation of TCP streams, including DPI, don=E2=80=99t =
always react as well as modern TCP endpoints
> =20
> - the impact on fragmentation and reassembly is not addressed =
sufficiently; the discussion should cite the primary requirements (791, =
8200) and go into a bit more detail.
> =20
> - IPsec is clearly sensitive to reordering. Most protocols, TCP =
included, can adapt to some level of reordering only up to a limit. Not =
only are there limits, but (as noted above) there is a cost at the =
receiver to support these capabilities. This doesn=E2=80=99t appear to =
be addressed.
> =20
> - there are MANY variations to TCP as deployed, as well as other =
protocols. Implementations with compromised resources, such as in IoT or =
low-power devices, may not all be up to =E2=80=9Cmodern=E2=80=9D =
standards.
> =20
> - there are protocols that require ordering at L2 (ATM being the =
primary example); it is useful to reiterate that this document isn=E2=80=99=
t recommending a change that would violate other L2 semantics that =
depend on ordering.
> =20
> AFAICT, the only clear requirements here are:
> =20
>> Subnetwork implementers SHOULD avoid introducing unnecessary packet =
reordering. However, where packet reordering is an unavoidable =
consequence of mechanisms that improve overall performance or =
reliability (for example, packet striping across multiple links or =
link-layer retransmissions), the resulting packet reordering SHOULD =
generally be exposed to the receiving endpoint rather than hidden by =
subnetwork resequencing.
>>=20
> RFC3819 says:
> =20
>    This suggests that subnetwork implementers should try to avoid =
packet
>    reordering whenever possible, but not if doing so compromises
>    efficiency, impairs reliability, or increases average packet delay.
> =20
> It isn=E2=80=99t clear that this document is saying anything different =
from RFC3819.
> =20
> It may be useful as informational, but as presented it isn=E2=80=99t =
clear it should be a BCP; at best, it is an informative update to the =
context in which RFC3819 recommendations remain valid.
> =20
> Joe
>=20
>=20
>> On Jul 7, 2026, at 9:19=E2=80=AFAM, Greg White =
<[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>> =20
>> FYI
>>=20
>> On 7/6/26, 5:25 PM, "[email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>" =
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> =
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>=20
>>=20
>> A new version of Internet-Draft draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt =
has been
>> successfully submitted by Greg White and posted to the
>> IETF repository.
>>=20
>>=20
>> Name: draft-white-intarea-reordering
>> Revision: 04
>> Title: Proposal for Updates to Guidance on Packet Reordering
>> Date: 2026-07-06
>> Group: Individual Submission
>> Pages: 12
>> URL: =
https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt =
<https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt>
>> Status: =
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reordering/ =
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reordering/>
>> HTML: =
https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.html =
<https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.html>
>> HTMLized: =
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reordering =
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reordering>
>> Diff: =
https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intarea-reordering=
-04 =
<https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intarea-reorderin=
g-04>
>>=20
>>=20
>> Abstract:
>>=20
>>=20
>> Several link technology standards mandate that equipment guarantee
>> in-order delivery of layer 2 frames, apparently due to a belief that
>> this is required by higher layer protocols. To meet this requirement
>> they implement a "resequencing" operation to restore the original
>> packet order. This can introduce delays that result in net
>> degradation of performance. Modern TCP and QUIC implementations
>> support features that significantly improve their tolerance to out-
>> of-order delivery. This draft is intended to provide new information
>> for layer 2 technology standards regarding the need to assure in-
>> order delivery to support IETF protocols.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> The IETF Secretariat
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> IPsec mailing list -- [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
>> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>
> =20
> _______________________________________________
> IPsec mailing list -- [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] =
<mailto:[email protected]>

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<html aria-label=3D"message body"><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" =
content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body =
style=3D"overflow-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
line-break: after-white-space;">FWIW, IMO reordering and resquencing are =
synonymous. I would not expect readers to track the difference, even if =
coined as different in this document.<div><br></div><div>I would =
encourage =E2=80=9Cmisordering=E2=80=9D as a more reliably interpreted =
term for changing the order of packets from their =
arrival.</div><div><br></div><div>Also note: reordering and resequencing =
both could mean EITHER =E2=80=9Cputting things in the correct order=E2=80=9D=
 or =E2=80=9Cputting things back to the order in which they arrived=E2=80=9D=
 (which may not be correct).</div><div><br></div><div>Delay is added =
whenever EITHER type of reordering/resequencing occurs - or (notably) =
when misordering occurs in the first =
place.</div><div><br></div><div>Another type of delay that midpoint =
nodes should not try to correct is jitter, i.e., variation in the =
arrival of a packet stream. Again, any attempt to change the arrival =
pattern necessarily introduces delay - as does anything that increases =
that variation.</div><div><br></div><div>I.e., the doc focuses on =
situations where the endpoint could allow packets to arrive out of =
order, but that=E2=80=99s not the only reason to avoid =
resequencing.</div><div><br></div><div>Joe&nbsp;</div><div><div><br><block=
quote type=3D"cite"><div>On Aug 3, 2026, at 4:51=E2=80=AFPM, Greg White =
&lt;[email protected]&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div><meta charset=3D"UTF-8"><div =
class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: WordSection1; caret-color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-line: none; =
text-decoration-thickness: auto; text-decoration-style: solid;"><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">Hi =
Joe,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">Thanks for the detailed feedback, this is =
very helpful. We will try to tackle as many of these suggestions as we =
can in the next version.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">For clarity, in the draft =
we defined the terms =E2=80=9Creordering=E2=80=9D =3D making packet out =
of order, =E2=80=9Cresequencing=E2=80=9D =3D putting them back in order. =
&nbsp;To help avoid confusion, I=E2=80=99ve edited your points to align =
with this terminology - with square brackets where I=E2=80=99ve made a =
change.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">On your final point that it isn=E2=80=99t =
clear that this document is saying anything different from RFC3819: yes, =
the two excerpts you quoted aren=E2=80=99t markedly different, and<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.=
html#section-1-2" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">Section 1 paragraph 2</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>indicates that the main =
issue with RFC3819 isn=E2=80=99t that statement, it is the text that =
follows.&nbsp; Also, I think we=E2=80=99ll end up with more concrete =
recommendations than what are in the draft =
currently.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">-Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"border-width: 1pt medium medium; border-style: solid none none; =
border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) currentcolor currentcolor; =
border-image: none; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">From:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Joe Touch &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt;<br><b>Date:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Monday, August 3, 2026 =
at 8:42=E2=80=AFAM<br><b>To:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Greg White &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Internet Area &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Re: [IPsec] New Version =
Notification for =
draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><d=
iv style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">Hi, =
all,<o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;">Although the new and updated information provided in this =
document could be useful, it=E2=80=99s not clear that this document =
supersedes any of the advice provided in RFC =
3819.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">Additionally, it =
omits key information as to why layer 2 frame ordering is maintained in =
certain protocols.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">In =
particular:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- the abstract =
describes that [resequencing] =E2=80=9Ccan introduce delays that result =
in net degradation of performance=E2=80=9D. Those delays can also be =
irrelevant, e.g., if no further [resequencing] occurs and the receiver =
[resequences] anyway (as with TCP). The lack of such [resequencing] can =
also increase work at the receiver, as when TCP sends SACK rather than =
cumulative ACK. I.e., the impact is not always =
clear.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- on-path =
interpretation of TCP streams, including DPI, don=E2=80=99t always react =
as well as modern TCP endpoints<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- the impact on =
fragmentation and reassembly is not addressed sufficiently; the =
discussion should cite the primary requirements (791, 8200) and go into =
a bit more detail.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- IPsec is =
clearly sensitive to reordering. Most protocols, TCP included, can adapt =
to some level of reordering only up to a limit. Not only are there =
limits, but (as noted above) there is a cost at the receiver to support =
these capabilities. This doesn=E2=80=99t appear to be =
addressed.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- there are MANY =
variations to TCP as deployed, as well as other protocols. =
Implementations with compromised resources, such as in IoT or low-power =
devices, may not all be up to =E2=80=9Cmodern=E2=80=9D =
standards.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">- there are =
protocols that require ordering at L2 (ATM being the primary example); =
it is useful to reiterate that this document isn=E2=80=99t recommending =
a change that would violate other L2 semantics that depend on =
ordering.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">AFAICT, the only =
clear requirements here are:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><blockquote =
style=3D"margin-left: 30pt; margin-right: 0in;" type=3D"cite"><div><p =
id=3D"section-5-5" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-bottom: 12pt; =
margin-left: 0in; caret-color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"><span =
style=3D"font-family: &quot;Noto Sans&quot;, sans-serif; color: rgb(34, =
34, 34);">Subnetwork implementers SHOULD avoid introducing unnecessary =
packet reordering. However, where packet reordering is an unavoidable =
consequence of mechanisms that improve overall performance or =
reliability (for example, packet striping across multiple links or =
link-layer retransmissions), the resulting packet reordering SHOULD =
generally be exposed to the receiving endpoint rather than hidden by =
subnetwork =
resequencing.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;">RFC3819 says:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"border: 1pt =
solid windowtext; padding: 0in;"><pre style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
10pt; font-family: &quot;Courier New&quot;; border: medium; padding: =
0in; box-sizing: border-box; font-feature-settings: =
var(--default-mono-font-feature-settings,normal); =
font-variation-settings: =
var(--default-mono-font-variation-settings,normal); text-wrap-mode: =
wrap; break-before: page;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
This suggests that subnetwork implementers should try to avoid =
packet<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
10pt; font-family: &quot;Courier New&quot;; border: medium; padding: =
0in;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp; reordering whenever =
possible, but not if doing so compromises<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 10pt; font-family: &quot;Courier =
New&quot;; border: medium; padding: 0in;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
12pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp; efficiency, impairs reliability, or increases =
average packet delay.<o:p></o:p></span></pre></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">It isn=E2=80=99t =
clear that this document is saying anything different from =
RFC3819.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">It may be useful =
as informational, but as presented it isn=E2=80=99t clear it should be a =
BCP; at best, it is an informative update to the context in which =
RFC3819 recommendations remain valid.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;">Joe<o:p></o:p></div><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;"><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: =
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;" type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;">On Jul 7, 2026, at =
9:19<span style=3D"font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">=E2=80=AF</span>AM, =
Greg White &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"=
 style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">[email protected]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Aptos, sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div><div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Aptos, =
sans-serif;">FYI<br><br>On 7/6/26, 5:25 PM, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, =
134); text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, =
134); text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:[email protected]</a>&gt;" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, =
134); text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, =
134); text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:[email protected]</a>&gt;&gt; =
wrote:<br><br><br>A new version of Internet-Draft =
draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt has been<br>successfully submitted =
by Greg White and posted to the<br>IETF repository.<br><br><br>Name: =
draft-white-intarea-reordering<br>Revision: 04<br>Title: Proposal for =
Updates to Guidance on Packet Reordering<br>Date: 2026-07-06<br>Group: =
Individual Submission<br>Pages: 12<br>URL:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.=
txt" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering=
-04.txt</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.=
txt" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering=
-04.txt</a>&gt;<br>Status:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reordering/" =
style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reorderin=
g/</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reordering/" =
style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-white-intarea-reorderin=
g/</a>&gt;<br>HTML:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.=
html" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering=
-04.html</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.=
html" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-white-intarea-reordering=
-04.html</a>&gt;<br>HTMLized:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reorderi=
ng" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reor=
dering</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reorderi=
ng" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-white-intarea-reor=
dering</a>&gt;<br>Diff:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intarea-re=
ordering-04" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intare=
a-reordering-04</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>&lt;<a =
href=3D"https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intarea-re=
ordering-04" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); text-decoration: =
underline;">https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=3Ddraft-white-intare=
a-reordering-04</a>&gt;<br><br><br>Abstract:<br><br><br>Several link =
technology standards mandate that equipment guarantee<br>in-order =
delivery of layer 2 frames, apparently due to a belief that<br>this is =
required by higher layer protocols. To meet this requirement<br>they =
implement a "resequencing" operation to restore the original<br>packet =
order. This can introduce delays that result in net<br>degradation of =
performance. Modern TCP and QUIC implementations<br>support features =
that significantly improve their tolerance to out-<br>of-order delivery. =
This draft is intended to provide new information<br>for layer 2 =
technology standards regarding the need to assure in-<br>order delivery =
to support IETF protocols.<br><br><br><br><br><br><br>The IETF =
Secretariat<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>_______________________________=
________________<br>IPsec mailing list --<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline;">[email protected]</a><br>To unsubscribe send =
an email to<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[email protected]</a><o:p></o:p></div></div></div></blockqu=
ote></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
Aptos, sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div></div></div><span =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
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!important;">_______________________________________________</span><br =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
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text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-line: none; =
text-decoration-thickness: auto; text-decoration-style: solid;"><span =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; =
display: inline !important;">IPsec mailing list --<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">[email protected]</a><br =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-line: none; =
text-decoration-thickness: auto; text-decoration-style: solid;"><span =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; =
display: inline !important;">To unsubscribe send an email to<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" style=3D"color: rgb(70, 120, 134); =
text-decoration: underline; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
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0px;">[email protected]</a></div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></=
html>=

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