[Int-area] Re: [IPv6]ICMP Query and ICMP Query for IOAM
"Bonica, Ron" <[email protected]> Wed, 25 Feb 2026 15:14:42 +0000
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.int,gmane.ietf.ipv6 |
|---|---|
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Sebastian,
Good catch!
We should also mention the other point that you raise in an operational con=
sideration section.
Ron
________________________________
From: Sebastian Moeller <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2026 5:14 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected] <[email protected]>; [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: [Int-area] Re: [IPv6]ICMP Query and ICMP Query for IOAM
Hi,
quick note:
The draft states:
To prevent denial of service attacks, the ICMP Query Response message MUST =
NOT be longer than the corresponding ICMP Query Request message.
IMHO this reasonable requirement does prevent amplification more than it in=
hibits denial of service attacks... How well this lends itself to denial of=
service attacks (on the queried host), IMHO, depends more on how costly th=
e requested pieces of information are to gather... and since the draft refe=
rs to another (not yet written?) draft for the actual queries this is hard =
to assess.
For using this to create reflection attacks on other hosts this size limit =
really also only affects the effective amplification when using that attack=
vector, but if an attacker commands enough nodes no amplification is requi=
red to create a denial of service attack. So I would just rephrase that sen=
tence from "To prevent denial of service attacks,..." to "To remove to pote=
ntial of abusing this as a means of attack amplification,..."
Regards
Sebastian
> On 25. Feb 2026, at 09:10, [email protected] wrote:
>
> Dear all,
>
> A new document draft-xbm-intarea-icmp-query-00 has been submitted. This d=
raft introduces two new ICMP messages (ICMP Query Request/Response) for the=
purpose of IP node information query.
> After that, draft-ietf-6man-icmpv6-conf-state was updated and its basis w=
as changed from RFC 4620 to draft-xbm-intarea-icmp-query.
> Links for the two drafts are as below.
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-x=
bm-intarea-icmp-query-00__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO=
0RuCR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL865Sw5Z$ https://urldefens=
e.com/v3/__https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-icmpv6-ioa=
m-conf-state-10__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0RuCR00J_=
4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL07ovgvJ$
> Looking forward to your review and comments.
>
> Cheers,
> Xiao Min
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list
> [email protected]
> List Info: https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://mailman3.ietf.org/mailman3=
/lists/[email protected]/__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0Ru=
CR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL6vA_2y6$
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
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To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
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Sebastian,</div>
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Good catch!</div>
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We should also mention the other point that you raise in an operational con=
sideration section.</div>
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 =
; &nb=
sp; Ron</div>
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<b>From:</b> Sebastian Moeller <[email protected]&=
gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 25, 2026 5:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> [email protected] <[email protected]><br>
<b>Cc:</b> [email protected] <[email protected]>; [email protected] =
<[email protected]><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Int-area] Re: [IPv6]ICMP Query and ICMP Query for IOA=
M </div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 11pt;">Hi,<br>
<br>
quick note:<br>
<br>
The draft states:<br>
To prevent denial of service attacks, the ICMP Query Response message MUST =
NOT be longer than the corresponding ICMP Query Request message.<br>
<br>
IMHO this reasonable requirement does prevent amplification more than it in=
hibits denial of service attacks... How well this lends itself to denial of=
service attacks (on the queried host), IMHO, depends more on how costly th=
e requested pieces of information
are to gather... and since the draft refers to another (not yet written?) =
draft for the actual queries this is hard to assess.<br>
For using this to create reflection attacks on other hosts this size limit =
really also only affects the effective amplification when using that attack=
vector, but if an attacker commands enough nodes no amplification is requi=
red to create a denial of service
attack. So I would just rephrase that sentence from "To prevent denia=
l of service attacks,..." to "To remove to potential of abusing t=
his as a means of attack amplification,..."<br>
<br>
Regards<br>
Sebastian<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
> On 25. Feb 2026, at 09:10, [email protected] wrote:<br>
><br>
> Dear all,<br>
><br>
> A new document draft-xbm-intarea-icmp-query-00 has been submitted. Thi=
s draft introduces two new ICMP messages (ICMP Query Request/Response) for =
the purpose of IP node information query.<br>
> After that, draft-ietf-6man-icmpv6-conf-state was updated and its basi=
s was changed from RFC 4620 to draft-xbm-intarea-icmp-query.<br>
> Links for the two drafts are as below.<br>
> <a data-auth=3D"NotApplicable" class=3D"OWAAutoLink" id=3D"OWAaffd3b5a=
-9b9f-d430-a58c-f22b0333042c" href=3D"https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-xbm-intarea-icmp-query-00__;!!NpxR!j6oKY=
NANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0RuCR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93Zz=
wanJieknL865Sw5Z$">
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-xbm=
-intarea-icmp-query-00__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0R=
uCR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL865Sw5Z$</a>
<a data-auth=3D"NotApplicable" class=3D"OWAAutoLink" id=3D"OWAb0549d39-5841=
-be65-59d5-30a3fbbf1741" href=3D"https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://datatr=
acker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-icmpv6-ioam-conf-state-10__;!!NpxR!=
j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0RuCR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrt=
j93ZzwanJieknL07ovgvJ$">
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-iet=
f-6man-icmpv6-ioam-conf-state-10__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4E=
RJsioDhO0RuCR00J_4tAZRm-FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL07ovgvJ$</a> <=
br>
> Looking forward to your review and comments.<br>
><br>
> Cheers,<br>
> Xiao Min<br>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------<b=
r>
> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list<br>
> [email protected]<br>
> List Info: <a data-auth=3D"NotApplicable" class=3D"OWAAutoLink" id=3D"=
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etf.org/__;!!NpxR!j6oKYNANTA9WORuGLBq22srq3D5NQDh4ERJsioDhO0RuCR00J_4tAZRm-=
FwqH5LGTMGFtsecWrtj93ZzwanJieknL6vA_2y6$</a><br>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------<b=
r>
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