[manet] Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Re: Fwd: New Version No tification for draft-eastlake-manet-babel-wi-fi-00.txt
Christopher Dearlove <[email protected]> Thu, 16 Jul 2026 19:03:34 +0100
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.manet |
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v=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body dir=3D=
"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr">I would need to know more than I do about Wi-Fi oper=
ation to be able to answer that.</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D=
"cite">On 16 Jul 2026, at 18:52, Templin (US), Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boe=
ing.com> wrote:<br></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D=
"ltr">=EF=BB=BF
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Thanks Christopher =E2=
=80=93 then </span>
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">is OLSRv2 already compatible with Wi-Fi mes=
h, or does someone need to write up a short draft on that like what Donald h=
as done for Babel? I will stop asking questions now if this one can be answe=
red.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Fred</span><span sty=
le=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></s=
pan></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo=
nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Christopher Dearlove <christop=
[email protected]>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 16, 2026 10:44 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Templin (US), Fred L <[email protected]><br>
<b>Cc:</b> bebemaster <[email protected]>; Juliusz Chroboczek <j=
[email protected]>; Donald Eastlake <[email protected]>; manet <manet@ie=
tf.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [manet] Re: Fwd: New Version Notification=
for draft-eastlake-manet-babel-wi-fi-00.txt<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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ound;mso-element-anchor-vertical:paragraph;mso-element-anchor-horizontal:col=
umn;mso-height-rule:exactly">
<span style=3D"font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#212121">EXT=
email: be mindful of links/attachments.</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<pre><span style=3D"color:black"><br> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">I would say could be used that way. It would be up to either a priv=
ate network to agree that or someone to standardise (in which I include expe=
rimental) that use for reference.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">Are there any such implementations? My implementation (never made p=
ublic, owned by my former employer) could have done so just by defining a ne=
w address class. I have no idea about others.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:"Times New Roman",serif">On 16 Jul 2026, at 18:09, Templin (U=
S), Fred L <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">Fred.L.Templin@b=
oeing.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Tahoma",sans-se=
rif">=EF=BB=BF</span><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman",=
serif">
</span><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">So based on RFC5444,=
then an address length of =E2=80=9C5=E2=80=9D would mean EUI-48 and an addr=
ess length of =E2=80=9C7=E2=80=9D would mean EUI-64? Or something like that?=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Are there OLSRv2 imp=
lementations that can operate based on MAC addresses?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Thank you - Fred</sp=
an><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo=
nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Christopher Dearlove <<a href=3D=
"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>&g=
t;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 16, 2026 9:49 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Templin (US), Fred L <<a href=3D"mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.=
com">[email protected]</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> bebemaster <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">bebemaster=
@gmail.com</a>>; Juliusz Chroboczek <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">jc=
[email protected]</a>>; Donald Eastlake <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">d=
[email protected]</a>>; manet <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">manet@i=
etf.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re: [manet] Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for=
draft-eastlake-manet-babel-wi-fi-00.txt</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt">
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t:auto;mso-element:frame;mso-element-frame-hspace:2.25pt;mso-element-wrap:ar=
ound;mso-element-anchor-vertical:paragraph;mso-element-anchor-horizontal:col=
umn;mso-height-rule:exactly">
<span style=3D"font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#212121">EXT=
email: be mindful of links/attachments.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<pre><span style=3D"color:black"><br> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
</td>
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<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">Strictly, it doesn=E2=80=99t. For reasons the actual definition of O=
LSRv2 and in particular the format in RFC 5444 only specifies IPv4 and IPv6.=
But to use MAC addresses all you need to do is just
use them. The address length is included and you can just use that.</span><=
o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:"Times New Roman",serif">On 16 Jul 2026, at 16:54, Templin (U=
S), Fred L <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]=
g">[email protected]</a>> wrote:</span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Tahoma",sans-se=
rif">=EF=BB=BF</span><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman",=
serif">
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Justin, I am interes=
ted in your statement that =E2=80=9CVersion 2 (supports) native mac addressi=
ng=E2=80=9D. Is that written down somewhere, and is OLSRv2 already compatibl=
e with Wi-Fi mesh?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Thank you - Fred</sp=
an><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo=
nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> bebemaster <<a href=3D"mailto:=
[email protected]">[email protected]</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 14, 2026 11:49 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Juliusz Chroboczek <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]=
</a>>; Donald Eastlake <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">d3e3e3@gma=
il.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Templin (US), Fred L <<a href=3D"mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.=
com">[email protected]</a>>; manet <<a href=3D"mailto:manet@ie=
tf.org">[email protected]</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [manet] Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-east=
lake-manet-babel-wi-fi-00.txt</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">I can't speak directly to ra-olsr, but olsrv1 vs v2. Version 2 prov=
ides a bunch of more advanced additions: metric routing, multiple interface s=
upport, message signatures, ipv6 and native
mac addressing, dynamic timing among other things. The biggest difference i=
snt just the increased functionality but the design allowing for extensibili=
ty natively without breaking the base protocol or backwards compatibility. I=
f some vendor wanted to add a
new service or dns information into the routing (OLSRv2) or discovery proto=
col (NHDP) that can be done while maintaining base interoperability of the b=
ase protocol.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">Justin Dean</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">-------- Original message --------</sp=
an><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">From: Juliusz Chroboczek <<a href=3D=
"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">Date: 7/14/26 12:54 PM (GMT-05:00)
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">To: Donald Eastlake <<a href=3D"mai=
lto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">Cc: "Templin (US), Fred L" <<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>>, man=
et <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black">Subject: [manet] Re: Fwd: New Version N=
otification for draft-eastlake-manet-babel-wi-fi-00.txt
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tim=
es New Roman",serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman"=
;,serif">>> Is a similar profile possible for other MANET routing prot=
ocols over<br>
>> Wi-Fi mesh =E2=80=93 for example, OLSRv2? Or is there something spe=
cial about<br>
>> Babel that makes it better suited for Wi-Fi mesh?<br>
<br>
In the original 802.11s, there were two routing protocols: HWMP, which was<b=
r>
MTI, and RA-OLSR (a variant of OLSRv1), which was optional. RA-OLSR<br=
>
failed in the market, I'm not sure if it is still in the spec (I haven't<br>=
read the recent revisions of 802.11s).<br>
<br>
What would an OLSRv2 variant embedded in 802.11s look like: in what way<br>
would it be different from RA-OLSR? (Real question, not rethorical,<br=
>
I genuinely don't know.)<br>
<br>
-- Juliusz<br>
<br>
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</div>
</blockquote>
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</blockquote>
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