Re: (M2PA) Initial version of M2PA IG is Now Available --to be? or not to be?

Hi, It's your friendly neighborhood AD. You might think I totally  
ignore this group but that's not quite true. I watch, and it seems  
like work is happening. I don't see how I can help the work in any  
way and it does seem to be moving along, so I don't do anything. I  
suspect this is fine with the WG and it's fine with me too. However,  
if things come up where you think I can help, or can help find  
someone else that can help, well don't forget I am a resource you can  
use. I doubt there is anything I can do to help here - two people  
passionately putting forward what they think is the best path is all  
normal and good.

Cullen


On May 29, 2006, at 5:27 PM, Ong, Lyndon wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> As hard as it may be, let's try to keep personalities out of
> the discussion.  I think that Jeff deserves some credit for
> having done the work to put together a proposal for an IG,
> although clearly there are some disagreements about the contents.
>
> On the other hand, Brian as an author is strenuously defending
> his original text.  Both fine.
>
> We need to look at the individual items in Jeff's draft and come
> to some consensus about where guidance is needed for the M2PA
> implementor and where it is not.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Lyndon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Craig, Jeffrey [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 11:06 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: [Sigtran] (M2PA) Initial version of M2PA IG is Now
> Available --to be? or not to be?
>
> Hello All,
>
> Regarding the silence on the M2PA IG: Let's give the community some
> time.
> There is no rush. I suspect that most interested parties are busy  
> making
> money and are not following the SIGTRAN list as closely as they  
> used to,
>
> especially considering some of the nonsense being posted.
>
> Brian Bidulock stated:
>> it represents the author's views only
>> does not capture any discussions from the working group
>
> <sigh>
>
> Brian's two statements are false. The material is taken from posts to
> the SIGTRAN list, issues identified at plugtests, issues identified
> during the course of numerous inter-operability tests Tekelec has
> performed, and issues identified over the course of many successful
> Tekelec deployments of M2PA in customer networks worldwide. The IG  
> draft
> was reviewed and approved by a team of Tekelec SS7 engineers prior  
> to my
> submitting it to the IETF.
>
> In a way, I was presented a catch-22 situation with the IG, since  
> after
> soliciting ideas for the IG on the list, several M2PA developers at
> other companies expressed interest, but suggested that they would help
> only after I submitted a draft. So here it is.
>
> Brian Bidulock stated:
>> is unsuitable in its current form as a WG item
>
> This is not a reasonable statement, but it is consistent with his past
> unreasonable statements to the effect that he would not accept any  
> M2PA
> Implementer's Guide. Brian has already expressed the view that RFC4165
> is perfect. Many people, including myself, disagree with him. Why  
> is he
> considered a credible reviewer of the M2PA IG?
>
> Brian Bidulock stated:
>> I suggest that draft-bidulock-sigtran-m2pa-test-06.txt be advanced as
>> an informational RFC.
>
> M2PA test specs are of value, but they are no substitute for a M2PA  
> IG.
> RFC4165 describes a good protocol, but it is a protocol that can be  
> made
> better and described better, and the IG is the place to do it.
>
> I would think that the public could benefit from those of us who have
> successfully implemented and deployed M2PA in real world networks. The
> M2PA IG is an excellent means for sharing the knowledge. Let's settle
> the argument about the appropriateness of the vehicle and move on to
> discussing the content.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jeff
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brian F. G. Bidulock [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 1:40 PM
> To: Ong, Lyndon
> Cc: [email protected]; Craig, Jeffrey
> Subject: Re: [Sigtran] (M2PA) Initial version of M2PA IG is Now
> Available
>
> Lyndon,
>
> On the contrary, in my case silence means that I disagree with the
> entire document.  IMHO it represents the author's views only, does not
> capture any discussions from the working group, and is unsuitable  
> in its
> current form as a WG item.
>
> OTOH, as test specs are suitable as informational RFCs, and there  
> is, of
> yet, no other industry test specification for M2PA, I suggest that
> draft-bidulock-sigtran-m2pa-test-06.txt be advanced as an  
> informational
> RFC.
>
> --brian
>
> Lyndon Ong wrote:                                (Wed, 24 May 2006
> 10:42:57)
>>
>>    Hi Folks,
>>
>>
>>
>>    I have not seen any comments on Jeff's first draft of the M2PA IG,
>>
>>    so assuming that silence means no concerns - are there objections
>>
>>    to making the next version a WG draft?
>>
>>
>>
>>    Cheers,
>>
>>
>>
>>    L. Ong
>>       
>> _________________________________________________________________
>>
>>    From: Craig, Jeffrey [mailto:[email protected]]
>>    Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 1:38 PM
>>    To: [email protected]
>>    Subject: [Sigtran] (M2PA) Initial version of M2PA IG is Now
> Available
>>
>>    Hello All,
>>
>>
>>
>>    The initial version of the M2PA Implementer's Guide is now
> available.
>>
>>
> [1]http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-craig-sigtran-m2pa-ig-00.
>>    txt
>>
>>    Regards,
>>
>>    Jeff
>>
>> References
>>
>>    1.
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-craig-sigtran-m2pa-ig-00.txt
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sigtran mailing list
>> [email protected]
>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sigtran
>
>
> --
> Brian F. G. Bidulock
> [email protected]
> http://www.openss7.org/
>
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>
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