[Int-area] Re: [tsvwg] Re: New Version Notification fo r draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt

Hi

Catching up on the email discussion. Thanks Greg for presenting this and thanks all for the interest in the work which I think can give very valuable input to 3GPP standardization. 

I think that it is relevant to ensure that fragmented IP packets are reassembled before they are forwarded to higher layers. This is already done in 5G and will remain in 6G as well.

I think that there was a discussion as regards to the relevance of this work. I agree that the draft can be improved in various way, the draft (and possible BCP) is however welcome as there seems to be a great deal of uncertanity in 3GPP as regards to how transport protocols, and other network protocols such as IP-SEC can tolerate out of sequence delivery. In the end it is about standardizing the right featires for 6G. IETF can here help to clarify the situation around out of sequence delivery.

Regards

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg White <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, 7 August 2026 01:07
> To: Alex Burr <[email protected]>
> Cc: [email protected]; TSVWG <[email protected]>
> Subject: [tsvwg] Re: New Version Notification for draft-white-intarea-reordering-
> 04.txt
> 
> Thanks Alex.
> 
> I'm not particularly knowledgeable on DSL technology but I did a quick scan
> through G.998.4 and it appears to me that this is describing an L1-ish feature
> where a stream of data (e.g. IP packets) would be chunked into 53, 64 or 65
> byte chunks, and then a negotiated integer number of chunks would get
> packaged into a larger FEC frame (DTU) that has a sequence number (SID). I
> agree that seems less clear that resequencing could be avoided in this context,
> since the DTUs may not align with IP packet boundaries.  But, I may be missing
> something.
> 
> -Greg
> 
> 
> On 8/5/26, 4:32 AM, "Alex Burr" <[email protected]
> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Greg,
> 
> 
> For reference, similar reordering is done in the ITU protocol G.998.4 (for
> impulse noise protection) with a 64ms delay_max. This seems to have been
> incorporated into G.9701 and G.9711, but with delay_max reduced to 16ms
> (specified to deal with impulse noise of up to 10ms duration, so some latency
> cost is inevitable). There are also channel bonding options which may be
> relevant. ( It's >10 years since I worked on this stuff, so don't take this as a
> thorough review).
> 
> 
> It is not clear to me if it is possible to avoid re-sequencing with these standards
> as specified, or if intervening mechanisms preclude this.
> 
> 
> It may be worth noting that in all of the above standards the re-sequencing,
> while serving a similar function to the ones already cited, is formally in the
> "Physical Layer Specification", i.e L1, not L2. So it may be that the audience for
> this doc is not only L2 designers.
> 
> 
> FWIW it seems anomalous that this draft updates a BCP with normative
> language, but is "Intended Status: Informational". But I guess this is still under
> discussion.
> 
> 
> best,
> 
> 
> Alex
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, 7 July 2026 at 17:22, Greg White
> <[email protected]
> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
> 
> 
> > FYI
> >
> > On 7/6/26, 5:25 PM, "[email protected] <mailto:internet-
> [email protected]> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:internet-
> [email protected]>>" <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>> wrote:
> >
> >
> > A new version of Internet-Draft draft-white-intarea-reordering-04.txt
> > has been successfully submitted by Greg White and posted to the IETF
> > repository.
> >
> >
> > Name: draft-white-intarea-reordering
> > Revision: 04
> > Title: Proposal for Updates to Guidance on Packet Reordering
> > Date: 2026-07-06
> > Group: Individual Submission
> > Pages: 12
> > URL:
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> > =0;>
> >
> >
> > Abstract:
> >
> >
> > Several link technology standards mandate that equipment guarantee
> > in-order delivery of layer 2 frames, apparently due to a belief that
> > this is required by higher layer protocols. To meet this requirement
> > they implement a "resequencing" operation to restore the original
> > packet order. This can introduce delays that result in net degradation
> > of performance. Modern TCP and QUIC implementations support features
> > that significantly improve their tolerance to out- of-order delivery.
> > This draft is intended to provide new information for layer 2
> > technology standards regarding the need to assure in- order delivery
> > to support IETF protocols.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > The IETF Secretariat
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
>

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