Re: Cryptic website (scares away potential users)

Hi

I wanted to get an ISO-image.

My eye caught the paragraph-headline "Om at komme i gang" (About getting
started). So I used the 2 links in this sentence:
"Hvis du vil begynde at bruge Debian, kan du nemt få fat i et eksemplar
<https://www.debian.org/distrib/> og dernæst følge
installationsvejledningen
<https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/installmanual> for at installere
det."
(If you want to start using Debian, you can easily 'get a copy' and then
follow 'the installation guide' to install.)

You wrote:
> Probably the easiest we can do is list popular operating system and
> hardware category combinations:

Yes - I think that would be brilliant!

Sorry if I offended you with my language, but when I saw that cryptic
list of options, I felt I had intruded into a closed club where I was
not really welcome.

Henrik

-- 
Henrik Rosenø, M.Sc (civilingeniør)
Website: www.Transformation.DK
Spiritual, psychological, ethical, and political subjects.

Den 29-10-2017 kl. 05:17 skrev Paul Wise:
> On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 5:50 PM, Henrik Rosenø wrote:
>
>> When I finally get to a page from where I can download a DVD ISO-image of
> The front page has a link to download the 64-bit PC Network installer,
> how can we make that more obvious to you?
>
> https://www.debian.org/
>
>> the Debian OS - https://www.debian.org/CD/http-ftp/#stable - I get these
>> options to choose from:
> All of the /CD and /distrib pages are due for a reorganisation since
> years, many people have complained but not enough of them were willing
> to work on it.
>
>> How on Earth am I to know which to choose??
> We have some infrastructure to translate between architecture names
> and non-technical descriptions of those architectures but
> unfortunately it isn't used consistently throughout the website,
> including this page.
>
> https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/webwml/webwml/english/releases/arches.data?view=co
>
> Also, I guess most non-technical users will never have even heard of
> anything except PC and mac. Due to Apple changing hardware suppliers,
> ironically both of those are now the same architecture (amd64) so I
> wonder if people are assuming Debian doesn't support macs now, since
> our amd64 architecture is only described as "64-bit PC". The phrase
> "64-bit PC" doesn't even describe other places where the amd64
> architecture is used, including on servers, tablets and some
> smartphones. Then there is the problem of the rise in ARM-based
> architectures on various smartphones, tablets, the Raspberry Pi,
> Chromebooks etc. I doubt many non-technical users associate any of
> these devices with the ARM architectures.
>
> So, I don't think it is feasible to explain to non-technical users
> which architecture they want, especially since that changes over time
> as hardware companies bring out new products and is very dependent on
> the marketing resources of global computer vendors.
>
> Ultimately a semi-automated human-guided detection system might be the
> only way to go but there probably aren't any people who have time and
> skills to implement that.
>
> Probably the easiest we can do is list popular operating system and
> hardware category combinations:
>
> Laptop after 2006 running Apple macOS -> amd64
> Laptop before 2006 running Apple macOS -> powerpc (but probably no
> longer supported)
> Tablet running Apple iOS -> sorry no support unless you are a hardcore hacker
> Smartphone running Apple iOS -> sorry no support unless you are a
> hardcore hacker
> Laptop running Microsoft Windows -> amd64
> Tablet running Microsoft Windows -> amd64
> Tablet running Microsoft Windows RT -> sorry no support
> Smartphone running Google Android -> sorry no support unless you are a
> geek or are willing to use one of the chroot apps.
> Laptop running Google Chrome -> sorry no support unless you are a geek
> Weird IoT devices -> uh, could be any of mips mipsel armel armhf,
> probably not supported unless you are a geek
> Server -> amd64
> Old server -> sparc64?
> New server from IBM -> ppc64el
> Server from companies selling ARM stuff -> arm64
> Router -> uh, could be any of mips mipsel armel armhf, probably not
> supported unless you are a geek
> Mainframe -> s390x
> Other -> ??
>
>> This puts the Debian website in the 100% nerd/geek category where the rest
>> of us just walk away.
>> Do you want me to find another Linux distribution instead?
> Please use a more friendly tone on Debian lists in future, as
> suggested by our codes of conduct:
>
> https://www.debian.org/code_of_conduct
> https://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct
>