Re: #lfs-support IRC

On Thu, Dec 12, 2024 at 7:09 AM Michele Bucca <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
> Inviato da iPhone
>
> Il giorno 12 dic 2024, alle ore 13:57, jeremy wiig <[email protected]> ha scritto:
>
> 
> It is clear the editors intend for the #lfs-support irc channel to be a place of condescension, denigration, fear, intimidation and cyberbullying. A typical interaction:
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> newuser> are there instructions somewhere i missed for how recompiling the kernel for blfs works?
> newuser> also is there a specific place i'm supposed to put the kernel source instead of just "/sources"?
> niceperson> why are you recompiling the kernel for blfs?
> newuser> i'm not yet, i'm just expecting i might want to
> niceperson> oh like upgrading the kernel?
> newuser> i'm using LFS as a learning exercise, so i'm not sure what BLFS software i might eventually want to install
> niceperson> have you got a running LFS yet?
> newuser> for this reason i also want to learn how the process of recompiling the kernel works for its own sake
> newuser> i haven't compiled the kernel the first time yet, so no
> niceperson> i have probably built and rebuilt the LFS dev version numerous times , each time fine tuning my scripts for automation, but there is the jhalfs if you really want
>                    automate
> newuser> i'm using LFS as a learning exercise
> niceperson> some start with a slackware .config , or there is the fedora .config
> newuser> i'm not planning on using this as a real system
> niceperson> copying that after the make mrproper
> newuser> my questions are 1. whenever BLFS says to recompile the kernel if necessary, does that include the mrproper step, and 2. should the linux kernel source directory
>                           be anywhere in particular?
> newuser> i became concerned because i learned that make mrproper also resets the kernel config
> newuser> and also i heard on a few places on the internet when i was trying to google about this some fuss about people putting the source directory in some spot or
>                           another and whether wherever it was is where it's "supposed" to be so i am also wondering if there's somewhere it's supposed to be
> niceperson> this could be a good read https://docs.kernel.org/
> niceperson> i had tryed /opt/source for my LFS source archives
> newuser> i'm assuming it's probably fine if the linux source is in /source like the other extracted tarballs, and that i can always move it later
> cyberbully> best to config it once nad be done  enable what ya need for blfs
> cyberbully> and*
> newuser> i'm also assuming that i should skip the mrproper step whenever i need to recompile, because not doing that would erase the configuration
> cyberbully> mrproper is always run every time a fresh untar is used
> newuser> i'm just a little nervous because the instructions aren't super clear about either topic
> cyberbully> right if you reuse the source again for a change/add  then no need
> cyberbully> the book isnt meant as a reference on kernel building  cmon
> newuser> i know lol
> cyberbully> you sound like ya dont know crap
> newuser> that's why i'm here, i'm working through LFS in order to learn the internals of a linux system
> cyberbully> lfs is written for experienced builders
> newuser> "One important reason for this project's existence is to help you learn how a Linux system works from the inside out. Building an LFS system helps demonstrate
>                           what makes Linux tick, and how things work together and depend on each other."
> cyberbully> right where does it say its for beginners
> cyberbully> and read the channel topic
> newuser> for the record i'm not a beginner, i've been daily driving fedora for a couple years now and i know pretty well how to use and debug a linux system
> cyberbully> thtas user level knowledge  not compiling source experience
> cyberbully> thats*
> niceperson> i would start by moving from fedora to either Arch or Gentoo as a daily
> newuser> which is why i'm asking specific sanity-check questions like "i've learned from reading the linux docs myself before even logging into the irc that make mrproper
>                           deletes the config file, so i assume i'm not supposed to do that?"
> newuser> as i've said, i want to learn how linux systems work internally, and i've mostly done that myself; i'm not interested in daily driving a fully custom linux system
>                           or automating the process, and that's because i know what i want, not because i don't know how to do things
> newuser> i understand that you guys must get a lot of confused noobs in these channels and that must be frustrating but i'm not appreciating the condescending tone
> niceperson> cause this is the support channel for the LFS book for questions regarding the building of the book, there is a separate channel #lfs for just chat
> cyberbully> too bad  go get the compiling experience and then you'll understand my tone
> newuser> i asked two very specific questions and got chatter in response
> cyberbully> you got accurate explanations not chatter a-hole
> cyberbully> care for  ban?
> newuser> i'm trying to meet you in the middle here
> newuser> you answered my first question, thank you for that
> cyberbully> you sound like a spoiled noob who expects to be catered to
> newuser> now i'm just wondering if there's anywhere in particular the linux source tree should be
> niceperson> have you read this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filesystem_Hierarchy_Standard
> newuser> i have, but thank you for reminding me
> niceperson> if you are building from source the LFS is what you make it, and how you build it yourself
> newuser> i will put it in /usr/src then
> newuser> i'm not expecting to be catered to, you've answered my questions perfectly well enough, i'm just expecting not to be called stupid for asking for support in the
>                           support channel
> newuser> but being that this is the support channel i'm not going to drag the topic out further
> newuser> thank you both for your help!
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> Thank you for providing such a cold place where idiot noobs with their ridiculously stoopid questions can be quickly put in their place and sent packing.
>
>
> Hi jeremy,
>
> I’m sorry for your bad experience, the act of insulting someone that has made a question, even a simple one, is not acceptable. I’m sure that the admins will take proper action.
>
> That said I would like to answer tha question that you asked on IRC and I hope to receive any corrections from people with more experience then me.
>
> Follow these steps as root
>
> 1. unpack your kernel wherever you want (/sources is fine, Do not put them in /usr/src/linux) and run
>    make me proper
> 2. Configure, build it and install it
> 3. Run chroot -R 0:0 on the Linux-X.YY.Z folder to ensure all files are owned by root
>
> Later if you want to add new modules to the kernel repeat the step 2.
>
> If there’s a problem with the compilation try:
>
>   make clean
>
> And then
>
> make
>
> Read carefully chapter 10.3 [1] of LFS, the page Using GRUB to Set Up the Boot Process with UEFI of BLFS (you can find a link to that page from chapter 10.3 of LFS) [2] and the index page of BLFS (longindex.html), Kernel Configuratin section [3]
>
> [1] https://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/stable/chapter10/kernel.html
>
> [2] https://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/view/stable/postlfs/grub-setup.html#uefi-kernel
>
> [3] https://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/view/stable/longindex.html#kernel-config-index
>
> If you need anything we are here
>
> Michele
>
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apologies for any confusion, i am in fact not 'newuser' but a casual
observer. it is quite likely 'newuser' will not return, as i have seen
many treated in the above fashion not post again.

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