Re: Centos7 : some ( official )help wanted
Jim Kinney <[email protected]> Thu, 2 Jul 2015 07:03:19 -0400
| Newsgroups | gmane.linux.redhat.k12osn |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <CAEo=5PxZgRSJTa_Hd2Kf-XRofBimD5eWWeH05iwZxOrJCOmPZQ@mail.gmail.com> |
--===============1284114479293960283== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c3bad8232c2d0519e26354 --001a11c3bad8232c2d0519e26354 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 In order to develop K12Linux further, it will require developers. Warren brought it from Centos 5 to Centos 6. He did this working alone. To migrate it to Centos 7 will require new developers to step forward and take over. I don't think Warren is interested. It was hoped that RedHat would pick up K12linux. That doesn't seem to be an option any more as their focus is on VM technology. I can't take on this myself for many reasons. The main one is I see the spice/VM process as a better successor. My day job has me swamped so my time is zero. On Jul 2, 2015 3:20 AM, "Radek Bursztynowski" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > p { margin-bottom: 0.25cm; line-height: 120%; } > > > Jim, > > > Thanks you for your > clear explanation. It means, that there are two separated cases. The > first one is the K12Linux's usefulness and the second one closing > down the project. In spite of K12Linux's usefulness this project is > shutting down. Is it appropriate understanding? > > > If yes, I regret. I > don't evaluate why, but I regret. > > > Are there any > chances to reanimate K12Linux project? > > > Best regards, > > Radek > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Kinney" <[email protected]> > Sent: Wed, 7/1/2015 9:10pm > To: "Support list for open source software in schools." <[email protected] > > > Subject: Re: [K12OSN] Centos7 : some ( official )help wanted > > On Wed, 2015-07-01 at 17:24 +0200, [email protected] wrote: > > Van: "Warren Togami Jr." <[email protected]> > Aan: "Support list for open source software in schools." < > [email protected]> > Verzonden: Woensdag 1 juli 2015 17:09:42 > Onderwerp: Re: [K12OSN] Centos7 : some ( official )help wanted > > Disagree all you want. If no developer is willing to do the work, then it > cannot happen. > On Tue, Jun 30, 2015 at 1:00 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello, > > I have good results on our first site where we run K12Linux on Centos7 and > I am about to ugrade a second, larger > site as well. > > I just had a look at the K12Linux website again and just wanted to say I > don't agree with this: > > Modern users probably do not want to use this type of thin client because > video (like Youtube) requires too much bandwidth over remote X desktops, > and scalability of X over ssh encrypted tunnels is rather poor. K12Linux is > considered a legacy solution for existing deployments of LTSP-type networks > and is currently supported only on the legacy EPEL6 platform. Porting to > more modern systemd-based Fedora and EPEL7 is technically possible but is > not considered a priority given the drawbacks of the legacy LTSP solution. > > I think a lot of organsisations have employees who 's first priority is > not watching youtube, all though my users have no problems with that on > K12Linux. > What hurts me is that because people can not get this to work on > Centos7/Rhel7, they are moving to Ubuntu. > > I have K12Linux/Centos6 running for about 3 years, and it's incredibly > robust. And I think it's the same on Centos7. > > greetings, Johan > > Warren, > > Then it should say on the site " no developer wants to do the work". > Now it says K12Linux is legacy. > > And Warren, I am grateful for the work that you put in for K12Linux. > > What I'm saying here, and I think what Radek is saying, is it's not > legacy, It works. > > Legacy doesn't mean it doesn't work. It simply means no further > development will be done for that particular setup. Sometimes a program > becomes legacy because no one is working on it. Sometimes because it get > superseded by newer projects. > K12Linux on CentOS 6 is a great tool. But porting it to be fully CentOS 7 > ready will require development from people other than Warren. K12Linux will > be around for many more years since CentOS 6 will be around as well. > I think it's time to look at alternate methods of achieving a similar > result. The PXE boot aspect will need to stay but the server platform needs > to be revisited. The IT world has embraced virtual machines. Maybe a thin > client should be running a VM client that provides console to a remote VM > running on a server farm. The spice client is remarkably light and can push > screen bits as well if not better than NX and RDP (and way faster than X > over SSH or VNC). Using a management tool like Ovirt would allow tech > support to build and maintain student machines as pool devices and thus > only require updates to a single machine. Some coding is required to > provide a single sign on screen that would connect to the next available VM > console (which then auto-mounts the students home directory). The VM client > (spice) can be 32 bit as well as 64 so it will run on older client hardware > and it supports USB pass through for thumb drives. Sound also works. > 3 years ago I was doing a demo talk of Ovirt and connected through 2 > layers of VPNs back to my work lab to show both windows and Linux desktops. > I started a browser and went to YouTube and the flash video played smoothly > and with sound synched to the video. > As KVM, the technology behind Ovirt virtual machines, supports "memory > ballooning", different VMs that need to use the same block of memory can > share the block (read only - best for OS and application memory) and thus > can perform similar types of resource sharing that K12Linux provided. Best > of all, each user is truly isolated from all the others so an application > crash (ahem - flash) will only affect the single user even with shared > memory. > > Greetings, Johan > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see <http://www.k12os.org> > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see <http://www.k12os.org> > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see <http://www.k12os.org>-- > James P. Kinney III > > Every time you stop a school, you will have to build a jail. What you > gain at one end you lose at the other. It's like feeding a dog on his > own tail. It won't fatten the dog. > - Speech 11/23/1900 Mark Twain > > http://heretothereideas.blogspot.com/ > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see <http://www.k12os.org>; > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see <http://www.k12os.org> > --001a11c3bad8232c2d0519e26354 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <p dir=3D"ltr">In order to develop K12Linux further, it will require develo= pers. Warren brought it from Centos 5 to Centos 6. He did this working alon= e. To migrate it to Centos 7 will require new developers to step forward an= d take over. I don't think Warren is interested. It was hoped that RedH= at would pick up K12linux. That doesn't seem to be an option any more a= s their focus is on VM technology.</p> <p dir=3D"ltr">I can't take on this myself for many reasons. The main o= ne is I see the spice/VM process as a better successor. My day job has me s= wamped so my time is zero. </p> <div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Jul 2, 2015 3:20 AM, "Radek Bursztynowsk= i" <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">radek@bursztynows= ki.waw.pl</a>> wrote:<br type=3D"attribution"><blockquote class=3D"gmail= _quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:= 1ex"><br> <br> <br> <br> <br> <br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 p { margin-bottom: 0.25cm; line-height: 120%; }= <br> <br> <br> Jim,<br> <br> <br> Thanks you for your<br> clear explanation. It means, that there are two separated cases. The<br> first one is the K12Linux's usefulness and the second one closing<br> down the project.=C2=A0 In spite of K12Linux's usefulness this project = is<br> shutting down. Is it appropriate understanding?<br> <br> <br> If yes, I regret. I<br> don't evaluate why, but I regret.<br> <br> <br> Are there any<br> chances to reanimate K12Linux project?<br> <br> <br> Best regards,<br> <br> Radek<br> <br> <br> <br> <br> ----- Original Message -----<br> From: "Jim Kinney" <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">ji= [email protected]</a>><br> Sent: Wed, 7/1/2015 9:10pm<br> To: "Support list for open source software in schools." <<a hr= ef=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>><br> Subject: Re: [K12OSN] Centos7 : some ( official )help wanted<br> <br> On Wed, 2015-07-01 at 17:24 +0200, <a href=3D"mailto:johan.vermeulen7@telen= et.be">[email protected]</a> wrote:<br> <br> Van: "Warren Togami Jr." <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"= >[email protected]</a>><br> Aan: "Support list for open source software in schools." <<a h= ref=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>><br> Verzonden: Woensdag 1 juli 2015 17:09:42<br> Onderwerp: Re: [K12OSN] Centos7 : some ( official )help wanted<br> <br> Disagree all you want.=C2=A0 If no developer is willing to do the work, the= n it cannot happen.<br> On Tue, Jun 30, 2015 at 1:00 AM, <<a href=3D"mailto:johan.vermeulen7@tel= enet.be">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br> Hello,<br> <br> I have good results on our first site where we run K12Linux on Centos7 and = I am about to ugrade a second, larger<br> site as well.<br> <br> I just had a look at the K12Linux website again and just wanted to say I do= n't agree with this:<br> <br> Modern users probably do not want to use this type of thin client because v= ideo (like Youtube) requires too much bandwidth over remote X desktops, and= scalability of X over ssh encrypted tunnels is rather poor. K12Linux is co= nsidered a legacy solution for existing deployments of LTSP-type networks a= nd is currently supported only on the legacy EPEL6 platform. Porting to mor= e modern systemd-based Fedora and EPEL7 is technically possible but is not = considered a priority given the drawbacks of the legacy LTSP solution.<br> <br> I think a lot of organsisations have employees who 's first priority is= not watching youtube, all though my users have no problems with that on K1= 2Linux.<br> What hurts me is that because people can not get this to work on Centos7/Rh= el7, they are moving to Ubuntu.<br> <br> I have K12Linux/Centos6 running for about 3 years, and it's incredibly = robust. And I think it's the same on Centos7.<br> <br> greetings, Johan<br> <br> Warren,<br> <br> Then it should say on the site " no developer wants to do the work&quo= t;.<br> Now it says K12Linux is legacy.<br> <br> And Warren, I am grateful for the work that you put in for K12Linux.<br> <br> What I'm saying here, and I think what Radek is saying, is it's not= legacy, It works.<br> <br> Legacy doesn't mean it doesn't work. It simply means no further dev= elopment will be done for that particular setup. Sometimes a program become= s legacy because no one is working on it. Sometimes because it get supersed= ed by newer projects.<br> K12Linux on CentOS 6 is a great tool. But porting it to be fully CentOS 7 r= eady will require development from people other than Warren. K12Linux will = be around for many more years since CentOS 6 will be around as well.<br> I think it's time to look at alternate methods of achieving a similar r= esult. The PXE boot aspect will need to stay but the server platform needs = to be revisited. The IT world has embraced virtual machines. Maybe a thin c= lient should be running a VM client that provides console to a remote VM ru= nning on a server farm. The spice client is remarkably light and can push s= creen bits as well if not better than NX and RDP (and way faster than X ove= r SSH or VNC). Using a management tool like Ovirt would allow tech support = to build and maintain student machines as pool devices and thus only requir= e updates to a single machine. Some coding is required to provide a single = sign on screen that would connect to the next available VM console (which t= hen auto-mounts the students home directory). The VM client (spice) can be = 32 bit as well as 64 so it will run on older client hardware and it support= s USB pass through for thumb drives. Sound also works.<br> 3 years ago I was doing a demo talk of Ovirt and connected through 2 layers= of VPNs back to my work lab to show both windows and Linux desktops. I sta= rted a browser and went to YouTube and the flash video played smoothly and = with sound synched to the video.<br> As KVM, the technology behind Ovirt virtual machines, supports "memory= ballooning", different VMs that need to use the same block of memory = can share the block (read only - best for OS and application memory) and th= us can perform similar types of resource sharing that K12Linux provided. Be= st of all, each user is truly isolated from all the others so an applicatio= n crash (ahem - flash) will only affect the single user even with shared me= mory.<br> <br> Greetings, Johan<br> <br> <br> _______________________________________________<br> =C2=A0K12OSN mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn" rel=3D"noreferre= r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</a><br> =C2=A0For more info see <<a href=3D"http://www.k12os.org" rel=3D"norefer= rer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.k12os.org</a>><br> <br> <br> _______________________________________________<br> K12OSN mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn" rel=3D"noreferre= r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</a><br> For more info see <<a href=3D"http://www.k12os.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" t= arget=3D"_blank">http://www.k12os.org</a>><br> _______________________________________________<br> K12OSN mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn" rel=3D"noreferre= r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</a><br> For more info see <<a href=3D"http://www.k12os.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" t= arget=3D"_blank">http://www.k12os.org</a>>--<br> James P. Kinney III<br> <br> Every time you stop a school, you will have to build a jail. What you<br> gain at one end you lose at the other. It's like feeding a dog on his<b= r> own tail. It won't fatten the dog.<br> - Speech 11/23/1900 Mark Twain<br> <br> <a href=3D"http://heretothereideas.blogspot.com/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target= =3D"_blank">http://heretothereideas.blogspot.com/</a><br> _______________________________________________<br> K12OSN mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn" rel=3D"noreferre= r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</a><br> For more info see <<a href=3D"http://www.k12os.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" t= arget=3D"_blank">http://www.k12os.org</a>>;<br> <br> _______________________________________________<br> K12OSN mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn" rel=3D"noreferre= r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</a><br> For more info see <<a href=3D"http://www.k12os.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" t= arget=3D"_blank">http://www.k12os.org</a>><br> </blockquote></div> --001a11c3bad8232c2d0519e26354-- --===============1284114479293960283== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list [email protected] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see <http://www.k12os.org> --===============1284114479293960283==--