Re: dbmail configuration

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Harald calm down. 

We have: 

root@rubidio:~ # dbmail-users -l | wc -l
 815 

815 mailboxes right now, more than 3TB of mails, with an huge mixture of
all kinds of client. Mac OS X Mail, Outlook, Android, iOS, whatever, so,
again, I can understand your difficulties, yet I don't understand if you
had problems with previous consultancy with Paul now you have to poison
an open source project. 

Nobody here is Paul, who, btw, is totally entitled to change is life and
drop a software or a job if he feels to do it. 

In any case my best suggestion for you is to switch to Office365 or to
GMail's business services: transferring mail from DBMail to their
service via IMAP is pretty easy and quick, and you'll have fixed SLAs
you can blame on. 

Even if you switch to, let's say postfix?, right now you'll have the
same situation when it comes to assistance in an open source product. 

---

Andrea Brancatelli

On 2020-04-06 11:26, Reindl Harald wrote:

> Am 06.04.20 um 11:05 schrieb Andrea Brancatelli: 
> 
>> I'm talking about latest commits, not about 3.0 to 3.1
>> 
>> BTW I did all the transitions from 2.4 to 3.0 to 3.1 quite smoothly so I
>> don't exactly get all your stress about this topic.
> 
> maybe you did it *after* my offlist sessions with Paul exchainging all
> sort of customer mails which where broken at reconstruction and not
> meant for public lists
> 
> P.S: when you reply only to the list you don#t break my "reply-list" and
> threading
> 
> And, like you do, in our company we have a lot of custom code relying on
> the SQL base os dbmail so I understand the cost of dealing with the SQL
> base changing. Yet again in our pro/cons valuations, it's cheaper to
> adapt our software to the evolutions than to adopt a new mail server.
> 
> Do your balances and act accordingly.
> 
> On 2020-04-06 10:52, Reindl Harald wrote:
> 
> Am 06.04.20 um 10:44 schrieb Andrea Brancatelli: There are no upgrade for the SQL base coming in, so you'll be able go
> just upgrade the software without any issue. 
> this is simply not true at all
> 
> there is some sequence colum added and i can't find my mail from years
> ago how to handle it in my admin backend which has capabilities to move
> messages from the admin backends between folders and even users
> 
> otherwise clients will go out of sync
> 
> Am 06.04.20 um 10:38 schrieb Andrea Brancatelli: You all realise there are a lot of commit coming in on GitHub, right?
> 
> https://github.com/dbmail/dbmail/commits/master 
> if nobody manages releases tha don't help much
> 
> given my expierience back when upgrade to 3.0 and especially 3.1 that#s
> the reason that i even don't consider update to 3.2
> 
> in both cases 3ö0 and 3.1 we had massive issues like completly empty
> mails with pop3, all sort of broken mails over imap depending on the
> mail body at reconstruction and it#s even unclear if all the bugfix fopr
> latest 3.1 made it to github
> 
> when i face similar issues as with the latest point update swith a non
> existent upstream making quick bugfiox releases i can commit suicide
> 
> On 2020-04-06 10:25, Daniel Urstöger wrote:
> 
> if you can that esaily.... and the uqaliuty of dovecot is also
> shitty, i
> know one which swicthed, just other rpoblems and never update short
> after a release
> 
> i have implemented 6000 lines of code for backends, automation and
> infrastructure integration back in 2009 and spent hundrest of ours to
> get the fucking 3.0 and 3.1 versions debugged and then upstream
> disappears from one day to another 
> I understand that people are very upset but by now everyone should
> realize that Paul has dropped the project and moved on. Dbmail came
> free and is open source so be happy while it lasted and be grateful to
> Paul, he made an awesome product!
> 
> So whilst the move to GitHub was brilliant its just one of the
> projects which is hard to maintain, as IMAP, LMTP, etc. are not easy
> to understand protocols so it never got much traction there and to be
> honest there are surely not so many C-savvy  people out there these
> days as well as the few pull request that came in didn't get merged
> and there wasn't a successful fork.
> 
> Also since there are alternatives out there that work really well, I
> used courier for many years now and moved to dovecot later on, well,
> there is not much demand for dbmail and if Paul doesn't make a grand
> return, lets face it: dbmail won't progress.
> 
> So, I also spent a great deal of time with dbmail setups and I even
> wrote a whole webmail application for it, which specifically blew away
> roundcube and others because it could fetch data directly from the
> database layer, but well, thats the past lets move on.

-- 

Reindl Harald
the lounge interactive design GmbH
A-1060 Vienna, Hofmühlgasse 17
CTO / CISO / Software-Development
m: +43 676 40 221 40
p: +43 1 595 3999 33
http://www.thelounge.net/

GPG-Public-Key:
https://arrakis-tls.thelounge.net/gpg/h.reindl_thelounge.net.pub.txt
_______________________________________________
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=
=3DUTF-8" /></head><body style=3D'font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Andale Mono=
",Times,monospace'>
<p>Harald calm down.</p>
<p>We have:</p>
<p><span style=3D"font-family: 'courier new', courier, monospace;">root@rub=
idio:~ # dbmail-users -l | wc -l</span><br /><span style=3D"font-family: 'c=
ourier new', courier, monospace;"> 815</span></p>
<p>815 mailboxes right now, more than 3TB of mails, with an huge mixture of=
 all kinds of client. Mac OS X Mail, Outlook, Android, iOS, whatever, so, a=
gain, I can understand your difficulties, yet I don't understand if you had=
 problems with previous consultancy with Paul now you have to poison an ope=
n source project.</p>
<p>Nobody here is Paul, who, btw, is totally entitled to change is life and=
 drop a software or a job if he feels to do it.</p>
<p>In any case my best suggestion for you is to switch to Office365 or to G=
Mail's business services: transferring mail from DBMail to their service vi=
a IMAP is pretty easy and quick, and you'll have fixed SLAs you can blame o=
n.</p>
<p>Even if you switch to, let's say postfix?, right now you'll have the sam=
e situation when it comes to assistance in an open source product.</p>
<p><br /></p>
<div>---<br />
<pre><strong>Andrea Brancatelli
<span style=3D"color: #ff0000;"></span></strong></pre>
</div>
<p>On 2020-04-06 11:26, Reindl Harald wrote:</p>
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0"><!-- html ignored --><!-- head ignored --><!-- meta ig=
nored -->
<div class=3D"pre" style=3D"margin: 0; padding: 0; font-family: monospace">=
<br /> <br /> Am 06.04.20 um 11:05 schrieb Andrea Brancatelli:
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">I'm talking about latest commits, not about 3.0 to 3=
=2E1<br /> <br /> BTW I did all the transitions from 2.4 to 3.0 to 3.1 quit=
e smoothly so I<br /> don't exactly get all your stress about this topic.</=
blockquote>
<br /> maybe you did it *after* my offlist sessions with Paul exchainging a=
ll<br /> sort of customer mails which where broken at reconstruction and no=
t<br /> meant for public lists<br /> <br /> P.S: when you reply only to the=
 list you don#t break my "reply-list" and<br /> threading<br /> <br />
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">And, like you do, in our company we have a lot of cust=
om code relying on<br /> the SQL base os dbmail so I understand the cost of=
 dealing with the SQL<br /> base changing. Yet again in our pro/cons valuat=
ions, it's cheaper to<br /> adapt our software to the evolutions than to ad=
opt a new mail server.<br /> <br /> Do your balances and act accordingly.<b=
r /> <br /> On 2020-04-06 10:52, Reindl Harald wrote:<br /> <br />
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0"><br /> <br /> Am 06.04.20 um 10:44 schrieb Andrea Bran=
catelli:
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">There are no upgrade for the SQL base coming in, so yo=
u'll be able go<br /> just upgrade the software without any issue.</blockqu=
ote>
<br /> this is simply not true at all<br /> <br /> there is some sequence c=
olum added and i can't find my mail from years<br /> ago how to handle it i=
n my admin backend which has capabilities to move<br /> messages from the a=
dmin backends between folders and even users<br /> <br /> otherwise clients=
 will go out of sync<br /> <br />
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">Am 06.04.20 um 10:38 schrieb Andrea Brancatelli:
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">You all realise there are a lot of commit coming in on=
 GitHub, right?<br /> <br /> <a href=3D"https://github.com/dbmail/dbmail/co=
mmits/master" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">https://github=
=2Ecom/dbmail/dbmail/commits/master</a></blockquote>
<br /> if nobody manages releases tha don't help much<br /> <br /> given my=
 expierience back when upgrade to 3.0 and especially 3.1 that#s<br /> the r=
eason that i even don't consider update to 3.2<br /> <br /> in both cases 3=
&ouml;0 and 3.1 we had massive issues like completly empty<br /> mails with=
 pop3, all sort of broken mails over imap depending on the<br /> mail body =
at reconstruction and it#s even unclear if all the bugfix fopr<br /> latest=
 3.1 made it to github<br /> <br /> when i face similar issues as with the =
latest point update swith a non<br /> existent upstream making quick bugfio=
x releases i can commit suicide<br /> <br />
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">On 2020-04-06 10:25, Daniel Urst&ouml;ger wrote:<br />=
 <br />
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">
<blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2=
px solid; margin: 0">if you can that esaily.... and the uqaliuty of dovecot=
 is also<br /> shitty, i<br /> know one which swicthed, just other rpoblems=
 and never update short<br /> after a release<br /> <br /> i have implement=
ed 6000 lines of code for backends, automation and<br /> infrastructure int=
egration back in 2009 and spent hundrest of ours to<br /> get the fucking 3=
=2E0 and 3.1 versions debugged and then upstream<br /> disappears from one =
day to another</blockquote>
<br /> I understand that people are very upset but by now everyone should<b=
r /> realize that Paul has dropped the project and moved on. Dbmail came<br=
 /> free and is open source so be happy while it lasted and be grateful to<=
br /> Paul, he made an awesome product!<br /> <br /> So whilst the move to =
GitHub was brilliant its just one of the<br /> projects which is hard to ma=
intain, as IMAP, LMTP, etc. are not easy<br /> to understand protocols so i=
t never got much traction there and to be<br /> honest there are surely not=
 so many C-savvy &nbsp;people out there these<br /> days as well as the few=
 pull request that came in didn't get merged<br /> and there wasn't a succe=
ssful fork.<br /> <br /> Also since there are alternatives out there that w=
ork really well, I<br /> used courier for many years now and moved to dovec=
ot later on, well,<br /> there is not much demand for dbmail and if Paul do=
esn't make a grand<br /> return, lets face it: dbmail won't progress.<br />=
 <br /> So, I also spent a great deal of time with dbmail setups and I even=
<br /> wrote a whole webmail application for it, which specifically blew aw=
ay<br /> roundcube and others because it could fetch data directly from the=
<br /> database layer, but well, thats the past lets move on.</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<br /> --&nbsp;<br /> <br /> Reindl Harald<br /> the lounge interactive des=
ign GmbH<br /> A-1060 Vienna, Hofm&uuml;hlgasse 17<br /> CTO / CISO / Softw=
are-Development<br /> m: +43 676 40 221 40<br /> p: +43 1 595 3999 33<br />=
 <a href=3D"http://www.thelounge.net/" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener no=
referrer">http://www.thelounge.net/</a><br /> <br /> GPG-Public-Key:<br /> =
<a href=3D"https://arrakis-tls.thelounge.net/gpg/h.reindl_thelounge.net.pub=
=2Etxt" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">https://arrakis-tls=
=2Ethelounge.net/gpg/h.reindl_thelounge.net.pub.txt</a><br /> _____________=
__________________________________<br /> DBmail mailing list<br /> <a href=
=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br /> <a href=3D"ht=
tps://lists.nfg.nl/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dbmail" target=3D"_blank" rel=
=3D"noopener noreferrer">https://lists.nfg.nl/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dbma=
il</a></div>
</blockquote>
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